Design flaw in Python?

[saltydog]

Has anyone noticed that the Python system with hose to sink does not vacuum up large debris such as detritus from large Plecos & other large fish? If I use a short Python hose into a pail then the force of the gravity suction is effective in removing this debris from the substrate. However, if I use the full system which relies on the ventruri at the sink it is rather ineffective. In my case, the tanks are located higher than the sink & so the evacuation of water is utilizing gravity as well the venturi effect. I suspect that the problem is caused by restricted water flow caused by the size or design of the valves in the hose. Any other ideas? Has anyone found a solution to this problem?

Also, I find that the valve at the sink which creates the venturi when emptying water from the tank does not close completely when filling the tank & so results in water being wasted down the sink drain. Is my Python functioning properly or do others also experience this?

By the way, I have tried usng a metal hose spayer at the end of a Python hose in order to weigh the end down so it does not accidentally flip out of the tank when refilling. If doing this be careful that the sprayer is not set so as to overly restrict the flow of water. I had a Python hose burst open & spay water all over the room including the ceiling. Lucky I was in the room at the time! I would imagine the same thing would occur if the water at the tape were to be turned on quite high & the standard on/off control at the other end were to be turned off for a period of time. Water pressuer will burst the hose.

[artw]

Hi Roger I think you may have a defective python
when I turn my sink on full blast I could probably suck a soccer ball through my hose
seriously it literally can pull the palm of my hand into the tube

I have to barely turn the tap on to NOT suck up gravel etc.
I agree when refilling it does waste water but why not just remove the blue pump and connect the hose directly to the tap?

[Evan]

Yes, I have the same issues with mine.

Never had water hit the ceiling though.

[saltydog]

Art,
That is interesting that you do not have this lack of suction problem as I know that some of your tank levels are below the level of the sink.

Evan,
It seems that you do have the same problem with suction. I wonder what it is? I do turn the tap fully on. Maybe I will try installing a new Python venturi valve. Anyone else have ideas or feedback on this issue?

[artw]

it is possible that the out-of-tap water pressure might have an effect

[BigDaddy]

If your pressure out of the tap is low, then you won't get good suction from the python.

As well, check to make sure all your fittings are nice and tight.

[Pisidan]

I find it is the connection and the Tap my last place it sucked like a mother could have used it as a vaccum cleaner for my floors..but where I am now Suction  is low..so I use another hose for big stuff into a pail and water changes with the python!

[Troy]

saltydog : My Python is great, strong suction and no problems with the refilling of my tanks.  
I use it on two taps in my house and only have a small problem with removing the plastic connecting ring between the metal faucet and the top of the green exchange adaptor.  :wink:

[Anubias]

I have the same problems vis a vis vacuuming and refilling the tank. Plant debris, if large, will eventually block the venturi system. The system doesn't close properly for refills. I thought of buying a new blue piece to replace the green plastic stem, but changed my mind. The tanks are vacuumed once a year.

Regards,

[JBL]

Some taps have less pressure due to water saving devices, I had that problem and removed it - after I had no problem with suction.

[saltydog]

Thanks for feedback so far about Python tank-to-tap system. I hope that everyone is not tired of my talking about it quite yet.

I believe that I have determined that the vacuum suction IS the fault of the green plastic venturi attachment at the tap. Once suction has begun, when I turn the water off at the tap my suction remains the SAME (as evidenced by the shell of a garden pea in the input tube which floats mid-way in the tube whether I turn the faucet full ON or full OFF. (My tank level is about 40" above sink level so water will flow due to gravity alone.) In other words, in my case, operation of the venturi accomplishes nothing except wasting water. When I disconnect the venturi connector & simply put the end of the hose in the sink I get more flow & am able to suck the pea shell up, as well as some sand. (Previously, suction was not strong enough to remove sand substrate.)

I have disassembled the venturi-hose-to-tap connector by removing the 2 screws. (By the way, these should have made from stainless steel so they would not rust.) I can see no evidence of broken or missing parts inside. The only user replaceable part appears to be the rubber washer which seals the connector against leaks at the tap. Mine looks fine. I have a second one of these venturis on hand which I also disassembled. It looks to be the same.)

Water pressure at my tap is not all that high, however I doubt whether low water pressure at the tap can account for these results. There is, after all, pressure strong enough to have burst the python plastic hose when I had a mostly-closed hose sprayer attached at the tank end.

When using the python suction (gravity-only) to the sink I still notice that I have far less suction than when I use a Python hose into a pail. Admittedly the pail is lower than the sink so this would be expected. However, these tanks are on 56" stands & so suction to the sink should still be quite high. I suspect that it may be the length of my hose which is slowing the flow. 40' of relatively small diameter hose slows the water flow due to friction between the fluid & the vinyl along the sides.

Any further thoughts, anyone?

Note to JBL: You mention: "Some taps have less pressure due to water saving devices, I had that problem and removed it - after I had no problem with suction." Could you be more specific with regards to what water saving devices you are referring & how you removed them? In my case I am attaching to an articulated hose with the kitchen sprayer head removed. I know that this hose has a fairly small diameter as it does not fill a bucket as quickly as an outside hose tap, for example. But why would this water pressure have NIL effect on the operation of the Python venturi?)

By the way, when I was vacuuming my deep sand substrate there were a LOT of  LARGE bubbles coming up. Could this be nitrogen gas from denetritying bacteria in sandbed or is it (poisonous) hydrogen sulfide (poisonous)?  Fish are healthy & appear fine. On occasion, however, I see all the Giant Danios (only) with mouths at the surface. This does not seem like normal behaviour to me.

[artw]

hey roger why dont you stop by my place and have a look at my setup.  I dont use the python products at all. I acutally use a walmart waterbed drain and fill system.  (its blue, not green)
Art

[dpatte]

Open House Party at arts place - when?

[JBL]

I use a water bed drain to garden hose too.

Saltydog - what I have is a mainfloor bathroom with facet and spray hose. In the facet I could unscrew the end and it has a plastic adapter with small holes to reduce water flow, I removed it and just left screen on. This increased water pressure equal to the sink I installed in my basement.  My wter bed drain has an adapter to fit the smaller threads so works great.

Note to all after doing this my Wife nearly beat me to death when she turned the water on full the first time and got a soaking!!

Also FYI for all I bought a RedLion water pump completely fish safe, you can hook up a garden hose to it and it will pump out about 700 gallons per hour to a depth of 1/4 inch. I use it if I have to completely drain a tank or pond - If anyone wants to borrow it let me know.

[artw]

what?  Aquarium cleaning party at arts place?
sounds great!

[JBL]

That's what we should start - cleaning parties !! haha

[saltydog]

Hey gusy & gals! I know that my forum topic sucks (or, at least, is suposed to!) but couldn't you all please feign a little more concern about  the problem that I am having with fluid in my hose?

[artw]

hmm maybe you should go see a doctor about that Roger

[pegasus]

I can't help you Roger. I don't wear Python, I prefer Haynes or Secret myself. They are usualy flawless and dry.

:idea: Maybe a gasket sealant could help.
Clueless in Aylmer

Michel