New 46G tank suggestions

[Kats]

Me again!!  OK, here is the list of items we've come up with so far for our new tank!!  It started out as My new tank but it looks like my hubby has gotten the taste of it too!!      It will be a great family adventure!!

Equipment:
we'll be doing a glass top with a 1 tube fluorescent light (40w)
a bubble bar (are the bubbles really helping the tank or more decorative?)
2 100w thermometer (instead of 1-200w... for redundancy in case one heater breaks)
1 AquaClear 70 filter

Fishies:
of course, our 5 angel beauties.
we'll add one oticunclus and a couple of corydoras (thans for the previous suggestions)

Any ideas on what other type of fish we could add to the tank that would not harass our angels?  We were thinking of getting some tetras...  any suggestions?

Any suggestion as per which order to introduce the fish to the new tank?

Thanks!
Kats

[Jeff1192]

I've always been a fan of fish that will do some cleaning for me and make my life easier . There are some really nice fancy plecos out there and shrimp also do a good job of cleaning things up. From my experience with angels don't get small tetras (eg: neons) or you'll find they disappear, especially when your angels get bigger!

Jeff

[beowulf]

Otos remain pretty small and prefer to be in groups so I would suggest at least 4-5 of them.  I also like the idea of a dither fish like rummy noses, say 10 of them for a tank this size.

[Laura]

Ottos definitely like to be in groups as mentioned previously, as do corys.  I would suggest getting 3 - 5 of the same species of cory.  You'll see their playful personality better in a bigger group.

If you don't already have the otto, bristlenose plecos do a nice job on the algae - busdriver on the forum has them for sale, and I would probably get two for tank this size.  They also like snug hiding places.

If you already know the following stuff - please ignore it and accept my apologies.  I assume you know to move over your established filter to the new tank (without cleaning it), and I would let it run with your existing fish for at least a couple of weeks before adding anything else to the mix to make sure the tank is stabilized.

I would also save as much of your old water as possible, and let the fish acclimate slowly to the new conditions - the new tanks ph my be different enough that you don't want to just plop them in.

I dont know if you are interested in live plants.  For your lighting levels you can only have very low light plants.  I would get a nice big piece of driftwood and attach java moss and java fern - both are available on the classifieds here for a good price.

[Kats]

Thanks for all your suggestions!!  Laura, you made me realize that I'll need another tactic to move my angels into the big tank as we will keep the 10G running...

Any suggestions?

[Crumpet]

a bubble bar (are the bubbles really helping the tank or more decorative?)

Thanks!
Kats

Congratulations on the new tank -- how exciting that the whole family is into it!
Just to answer your question about bubble bars-- if you are doing live plants, you can do without the bubbler.  It comes in handy when one is going plastic, as it helps to aerate the tank -- the more surface agitation, the more oxygen exchange.  But the plants would probably prefer it without the agitation.

[Laura]

If it were me, I would split the filter material between the two tanks.  Fill up the new tank with dechlorinated water, decorate it however you like, and then doing small partial water changes on your old tank.  I would put the old tank water in the new tank and vica-versa over the course of a day until you were convinced the parameters were the same.  Testing the water would be good here for ph and ensuring the temp is the same. 

Once I knew the tank parameters were the same, I would just flip the fish from the old to the new tank.

I would check the parameters over the next few days, just in case the tank goes through a a mini-cycle and accommodate with partial water changes.

I wouldn't add any new fish until I knew everything was hunky-dory.  I assume you are planning on using your old 10 gallon as a quarantine tank for the new fish - so you can have the fun of getting some of them right away.  I would get the schooling fish first and maybe the cories, let them acclimate for however long you should (I think people do a month, I did 3 weeks, but you may want to do a poll on that).  After they moved over, I would get the algae eaters.

Algae eaters also love to get fed zucchini and at the very least algae tablets.

As I said, this is just how I would do it, I am sure there are many other perfectly good ways too.  it's the funny thing about this hobby that lots of people have very different ways of following the same rules and it often works out great.

[Kats]

You guys are making my life/decisions so much more easier!!!

OK, here is another one for you:

I think I'm in love with the Bolivian Rams (aren't they cute!!!)  would they live well with the angels?

(ordering my tank tomorrow.... can`t wait!!!!)

[beowulf]

Rams, bolivian or otherwise, should be fine with angels. 

[Kats]

Nice!!  They will be on my list then!!

One last question then I think all my indecisions will be turned to decisions   

bio wheel versus aquaclear?   I have a biowheel now in my 10G and I have had aquaclears years ago...  Are the biowheels better or is it mainly a preference thing and both types are good?

whoa... sorry... another question:

I was planning to buy my plants/fish at Big Al`s.... are there some local breeders first that I could go to?  We already have 5 angels....

my wish list:

• duck weed
• java moss
• java fern
• 2 otocats
• 2-3 corydoras
• bolivian rams (?? how many should I get?)
• and/or small type schooling fish (rummy nose tetras)

Thanks!

[fischkopp]

bio wheel versus aquaclear?   I have a biowheel now in my 10G and I have had aquaclears years ago...  Are the biowheels better or is it mainly a preference thing and both types are good?

Many people prefer AquaClear, so do I. I find the way the water takes inside the filter a bit weird, also didn't like the fact that I could not find a way to decrease the stream.

my wish list:

• duck weed
• java moss
• java fern
• 2 otocats
• 2-3 corydoras
• bolivian rams (?? how many should I get?)
• and/or small type schooling fish (rummy nose tetras)

You can check the breeders directory on the left side. But all LFS should have everything from your list.

[beowulf]

I love the aqua clears due to to their ease of use and to clean and I can customize the media.  I would post your list in the classifieds and I sure you will be able to find a lot of it and then you could go to Big Al's or wherever for the rest.

[RoxyDog]

in that size tank, I'd reconsider any rams.  5 angelfish full grown take up a lot of room.  IMO keep the angels and add the cleanup crew and dither fish only, go with more than 2-3 of each. 

[BigDaddy]

Yeah, but the Angels hang out up top, and the rams tend to keep to themselves down near the substrate

[beowulf]

And with enough plants and caves should not be a big issue imo.

[Kats]

Thanks!  Beowulf, your suggestion about the classified ads is great!  I need to navigate a bit more around to find all the stuff.... I'd need a week off to read everything!!!

I've already found some fern and gravel!!!  Just missing my other fish now....  I smell the making of the nicest aquarium ever!!!  Wellllllll.... I am biased!!!   

The more I am reading about the fish I want in my tank, the more I am thinking that I will need more equipment if they start reproducing....  What are the chances that this will happen?  Is it a case of "I'm happy, let's make babies" or more something that is owner oriented and setup?  (I am totally ignorant for that aspect of fish life.... never had bigger than 20G tanks an no babies ever)

Thanks for your patience with my gizillion questions!!!!

Kats

[Laura]

The classifieds are great and the auctions are fun too.  You should definitely be able to get your plants at either.

I would strongly encourage you to get 3 or more of both the otos and corys – I would get 5 of each in your sized tank. 

Just to warn you, it is quite common to have losses with otos which is part of the reason I suggested the bristlenose – losses can be very disheartening, especially if you aren't expecting them.

[succinctfish]

Yeah, but the Angels hang out up top, and the rams tend to keep to themselves down near the substrate

Angelfish don't just hang out at the surface in my experience, especially in a tank this size and shape.  I have some in a 46 gallon bowfront, and when they are mature, and you take their fins into consideration, they take up a lot of room from top to bottom.  I would agree with Roxydog somewhat, and really think about not putting in any other fish than corydoras and otos, at least for the immediate future.  You could in theory, put in two pairs of rams, if you have the tank well planted, but even if you love them, you should wait on purchasing them. I would start with the angels, allow the tank to settle and adjust to the bioload of 5 fish, then add the corydoras and the otocinclis.  If you add the otos too soon, they might not survive, as they are delicate, and they feed on algae, so you need a somewhat established tank for them to do well.
To give you a sense of the size of adult angelfish, here is a (bad )photo of my 46 gallon bowfront and you can see one of the angelfish, who is almost at his full size. Notice he is not hanging out at at the top.    Now imagine  all 5 of yours this size. 

[attachment deleted by admin]

[Zoe]

Angelfish don't just hang out at the surface in my experience, especially in a tank this size and shape.  I have some in a 46 gallon bowfront, and when they are mature, and you take their fins into consideration, they take up a lot of room from top to bottom.  I would agree with Roxydog somewhat, and really think about not putting in any other fish than corydoras and otos, at least for the immediate future.  You could in theory, put in two pairs of rams, if you have the tank well planted, but even if you love them, you should wait on purchasing them.

I think you'd be okay with the rams.  Experience can vary and you might get some mean angels, but IME angelfish are aggressive to each other at times, but not so much towards other fish. I have an 85 gallon tank, 4 feet long, and the angels do spend a lot of time near the surface. Not exclusively, but it tends to be their general hangout.

Oh, skip the duckweed... pretty at first but you'll hate it when it covers the surface of your water.

It is entirely possible that your angelfish and/or rams will spawn.  It's fun to raise a batch of eggs once, but it gets old real fast if you aren't equipped for it and don't want to be. You WILL need several 20g tanks to raise them until they are sellable. IMO, if they spawn, just let them take care of the eggs.

[Kats]

Thanks for the info.

I am very interested in the rams but also want to make sure I don't buy them only to cause a turf war in my tank....  I have some time before I can introduce them anyway so I think I'll do more research on them, see how quickly I can stabilize my new tank and then decide. 

I've had a few of you already warning me off the duck weed especially since the type of fish I want don't eat it AND I want other plants...  Thanks, I will definitely stay away from the weed 

Good point Zoe, I will wait before getting the breeding equipment, I'm not sure I can dedicate that much time/space to breeding fish on a regular basis right now (well.... if I kicked out my teenagers... think of all the money and space I would have.....    )
Actually, my teens are really interested and helping out with the 10G tank as is, I think I'll keep them around a bit longer (need someone to do the dishes!!!   )

Have a good night!
Kats