C02 question

[BadFish]

Anyone have any experience with Carbo Plus?


http://www.petsolutions.com/cgi-bin/cgiitmls?m=ThisP&p=1061.100000&l=6

Trying to decide if I should invest in this type of system or go pressurized.  Any comments?

[Poustic]

I have never tried it myself, but here's a link with various comments on it: http://www.thekrib.com/Plants/CO2/electrolysis.html

Personally, I would look at the long term cost of running this system versus pressurized, the ability to regulate it (i.e. control how much CO2 it produces in order to keep a stable pH), and perhaps also how much space you have for your CO2 equipment (I imagine the Carbo Plus takes less space than a cylinder).

I had plenty of space in the cabinet for a pressurized tank and got a good deal on a used regulator and tank, so I ended up going pressurized myself.

[Ron]

Hi Badfish,

I'd go with the pressurized CO2 - more versatile, multiple sources of supply, and in the long run, much cheaper. Check the archives of the Aquatic Plants Digest for more information.

http://fins.actwin.com/aquatic-plants/index.php

Ron

[BadFish]

Thanks for the info, I was kinda leaning that way anyway.  You mentioned you got a good deal on a tank, valve, etc.

Any advice on where to start?

[Poustic]

It really depends on how fancy you want to get.   You can either keep things really simple like I did, and get a used tank, regulator, cheap needle valve and tubing, and feed the CO2 into the intake of a canister filter.  Or you can go really high-tech, and also get a solenoid valve, timer or pH controller, very fine needle valve, CO2-resistant tubing, bubble-counter, CO2 reactor, Swagelok fittings, the whole yadda.  I think the important part is how you're going to adjust it, dissolve it, and avoid potential pH drops at night (either by cutting off CO2 or increasing water movement).

I have:
- Used 10 lbs tank from Davidson's Fire Extinguishers on Percy. 235-1629 ($75).  Many sizes available, and refills at about $15-20 last for over 6 months in my 90 gal. planted tank.
- CO2 regulator (might be harder to find... got mine from a member of this forum).  Dual-stage is supposedly better than single-stage, but my single-stage works fine.  As long as it is made for CO2, has two gauges, and you refill the tank before it gets completely empty to avoid "end of tank dumps".
- Cheap $3 needle valve from the hardware store.  Really hard to adjust with precision, but I haven't had to adjust it in months.
- Tubing.  I got 1/8" copper tubing and fittings from Diotte Hydraulics, but you should be able to find the same at RONA or Home Depot, with some fittings to hook up to plastic airline tubing that goes in the water (copper is toxic to invertebrates), and teflon tape.
- Check valve, and fine air stone (small white ones are great).  I drilled a hole in the strainer of the canister filter intake, fed the airline tubing through the hole, and slapped the small air stone at the end.  CO2 dissolves completely in the canister filter.  I then adjust the amount of CO2 by measuring the water pH and KH.
- Air pump on a timer for the night.

If you're willing to spend more, there's a few neat packages out there:
Precision Marine, BlueLine, M3

[Eirikre]

Wow.  What would you suggest for a smaller planted tank, about 40 gallons.

[dpatte]

i use Do-It-yourself CO2 generation using sugar and yeast.

Initial setup is about $5, and then it costs about $2/month for sugar and yeast.

[cerickson]

DP

Tell me more about this DIY CO2 gen...

Sounds interesting, and i just set up a new planted tank for my mother, and the water is extremely soft (coming from the lake we live on.) and is very low in carbon.

[dpatte]

there may be a message on this website about setting it up already. Otherwise I'll write something in the next few days.

[Poustic]

Starting off with DIY CO2 is a great idea.  Allows you to see the benefits of CO2 without spending too much.  When I was using DIY CO2, I found that having two bottles hooked up together and alternating which one you recharge would allow to keep a reasonably stable output, but I couldn't quite get enough CO2 out of it for the 90gal tank.  Many articles on DIY CO2 on the various aquarium sites.  Here's one.

[cerickson]

Thanks so much! good stuff :)P

[dpatte]

Personally I use a cranberry juice bottle (about 2 litres). I mix 2 cups of sugar into the water which is room temperature, then mix in the yeast. I then fill the bottle almost to the top and add the cap.
The other end of the airline tube is placed into the intake of my power filter. This way the CO2 gets mixed by the power filter into the water during the filter process.

(Dont mix with hot water, or it will contract as it cools pulling water from your tank into the CO2 generator)

The bottle lasts about 6 weeks.

On my 75 gal, i actually run two bottles and change one of them each 3 weeks.

The airline from each bottle runs into a gang valve and the result is directed into my intake filter.

[Ron]

Just a couple of things to add to Dave's post above:

Be very careful using any type of valve to "control" the flow of CO2 - if it somehow gets plugged up, the resulting sudden and catastrophic release of yeast, sugar and alcohol can be difficult and smelly to clean up <g>.

Be sure to leave some air space in your yeast bottle, and to be safe, place it below the level of the tank. Another nasty and potentially lethal (for your fish!) mess awaits you if the yeast solution gets siphoned into your tank. And if you have a cat, for goodness sake, make sure they can't knock the bottle over!

HTH,

        Ron

[ambushman2j]

ahh that's a good point ron, I have a fairly young cat who loves knocking anything and everything over..if I ever come into some money and am finally able to buy a planted tank I would certainly have to consider that!

[artw]

DIY co2 is pretty cool for those of us that have 1 tank.   Any more and I would be going nuts every 3 weeks with sugar and yeast.

One thing David forgot to mention was how much yeast he uses. I use 1/2tsp.  I  have been experimenting and any more goes way too fast.  Less,  and the alcohol will kill the yeast anyway. so 1/2tsp is a good medium.

I also throw in 1/4tsp baking soda and this apparently reduces foaming.  In 2yrs I  have never had an "incident" with DIY co2 and I would find it hard to spend $2 a month on the system...  sugar aint that expensive:D