Breeding EBR

[mm]

Thanks for posting the pictures, angelcraze.

Unfortunately, like you, I lost the parents soon after they had the first spawn. They were sick with some kind of fluke or other parasites affecting their gills. I tried to treat them but it was too late. They were too weak. Soon after that I noticed that CJ put their tank under quarantine.

The good news is that 12 of the fry survived and are doing well (no losses for 2 months). I think they are out of danger. I hope to be able to get a new breeding pair from these. If you can try to guess the sex of your remaining juvie, I am happy to give you  a fish or two later to try to form a new pair.

I didn't find it hard for them to spawn, the eggs to be ok, or to feed the fry. But I had lots of losses in the first weeks, partly eaten by the parents (I am almost sure). In my experience given my water parameters (KH=0, GH=3, pH=5.2, TDS=102 with tannins from IAL and driftwood) the fish spawned easily and very few eggs got fungus or turned white. I had more than 100 fry at the beginning but a large number disappeared each day. Some got caught under the fluval stratum or other things but I think the parents (which I left with the fry) ate many. When they took them in their mouths to move or clean sometimes they didn't spit them out! I fed the fry BBS and microworms. They were eating well the BBS soon after becoming free swimming (you can see their full bellies). So I think feeding BBS will do the trick. But next time I will remove the parents after the fry become free swimming.

[soleil1980]

Wow!  Your tanks look very nice!

I have a 5g with a betta and a 30g with zebra danios and female bettas.  (I have other tanks too with guppies mostly).  I bought the leaves online.  How do I know how many leaves to put in a tank?  Can I put it with my zebras?  Also,  I noticed you have a lot of floating plants (what kind is it?), there is enough light going through for the plants in the substrate?

Sorry for all the questions   I really like the look of your tanks and would like to do one in my 30g.  I currently have pool sand as substrate, java fern, a few vals and java moss and guppies grass floating around...   I am not a big fan of the moss and grass.  I prefer the look of your floating plants.

Also, I want to put leaves in with my betta so I can try to breed them.  The tank is a 5g with a little bubble filter (I would turn it off for breeding as it would disturb the bubble nest.  It is a bare bottom with little pieces of guppy grass floating around.  If I put the almond leaves in this tank and do water changes, do I need to add leaves or the tannins will just keep being released from the same leaves?

Thank you for your time and once again, you have amazing looking tanks!

[mm]

Thanks!

One leaf per 5-10 gallons should be ok. I usually leave them in until they desintegrate and replace them at that time. You can also use them to make a weak tea if you want to increase tannins. If you do lots of water changes you might need to add new leaves or a bit of tea.

Zebra danios are not blackwater fish but they should do fine as they accept a wide range of water parameters see http://www.seriouslyfish.com/species/danio-rerio/.

The foating plants  are a mix but mostly Salvinia natans. This plant is very invasive. You have to thin it often or it willl block all the light but you should discard the surplus carefully so that it doesn't end in our water ways - you can compost it. The good thing is that it grows so fast that it is a ammonia/nitrate sponge. If you thin it there will be enough light for the plants in the substrate.

I never bred bettas (although they are similar to licorice gouramis) so I will let others give you advice on that.
Good luck!

[angelcraze]

Thanks for posting the pictures, angelcraze.

Unfortunately, like you, I lost the parents soon after they had the first spawn. They were sick with some kind of fluke or other parasites affecting their gills. I tried to treat them but it was too late. They were too weak. Soon after that I noticed that CJ put their tank under quarantine.

The good news is that 12 of the fry survived and are doing well (no losses for 2 months). I think they are out of danger. I hope to be able to get a new breeding pair from these. If you can try to guess the sex of your remaining juvie, I am happy to give you  a fish or two later to try to form a new pair.

I didn't find it hard for them to spawn, the eggs to be ok, or to feed the fry. But I had lots of losses in the first weeks, partly eaten by the parents (I am almost sure). In my experience given my water parameters (KH=0, GH=3, pH=5.2, TDS=102 with tannins from IAL and driftwood) the fish spawned easily and very few eggs got fungus or turned white. I had more than 100 fry at the beginning but a large number disappeared each day. Some got caught under the fluval stratum or other things but I think the parents (which I left with the fry) ate many. When they took them in their mouths to move or clean sometimes they didn't spit them out! I fed the fry BBS and microworms. They were eating well the BBS soon after becoming free swimming (you can see their full bellies). So I think feeding BBS will do the trick. But next time I will remove the parents after the fry become free swimming.

I think the thread got split up again, I thought we were talking about EBR fry, now I am not so sure if we are discussing tanks with very low pH or what?  I do think it's important to keep that pH low to prevent fungus on the eggs, I think that's why you had so much luck there.  But I also worry about pH fluctuations because it will no longer be stable, and opted to try to make it work for me with the params I had which was a pH of 6.8.  I figured it would be easier for them to transition into a regular community tank that way, and others could have better success with them, and, I didn't have teh time then to do daily water changes.  Like I said, I've learnt a lot since then and have some thinking to do.

Your offer was very nice, but my tanks are filled with angelfish at the moment, I got interested in genetic at teh moment, lol, which also get me thinking about rams and genetics, but anyway........I promised the remaining juvie to my mother, I am a bit attached.  If she doesn't want to deal with the harder-to-keep fish, I could always give him/her to you too, since it sounds like that's what you are into at the moment

[mm]

But I also worry about pH fluctuations because it will no longer be stable, and opted to try to make it work for me with the params I had which was a pH of 6.8.

I believe that the worry about pH fluctuations is part of the aquarium hobby confusion/myth. I don't think that it is the pH fluctuations per se that matter but how they affect the amount of ammonium/ammonia in the tank. The fish seem to mostly care about the amount of salts affecting their osmoregulation, the amount of carbonates and the temperatures.

Even with pH fluctuations, if the pH is lower than 6.5 most of the free ammonia is in the form of ammonium which is not very toxic and the fish will be fine. What you have to worry is having ammonium that turns into ammonia if the pH starts to rise above those values. With a KH=0 and the IAL/driftwood/fluval stratum combination, I find that the pH stabilizes between 5-6. Even if it fluctuates a bit with water changes the fish don't seem stressed and do not stop breeding. What I aim for is a constant KH,GH and TDS by making sure that for water changes I use the same parameters and for top-off I use distilled water. If you do water changes from time to time the pH will never drop much below 5. This is just my opinion based on my experience and what I have read (including some scientific literature).

[mm]

If she doesn't want to deal with the harder-to-keep fish, I could always give him/her to you too, since it sounds like that's what you are into at the moment

Thank you very much angelcraze but I don't think I need more EBR right now . I will keep a pair or two and the rest I will give away/trade/sell. I have too many fry of all sorts and soon I will have to start looking for good homes for them. Perhaps I can organize a free give away to club members if people are interested in breeding or keeping them.

[soleil1980]

last question... where can I get  Salvinia natans?  I don't think I have seen it in stores.  I wouldn't need much as it is for a 5g

[mm]

I can give you some. Just pm me.


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