Water chemistry anti RO/DI

[babblefish1960]

Additionally, Ottawa uses Chloramines, Chlorine, and spot dumps of chlorine bleach as well as a number of other things depending on the state of the river. I am personally against using RO/DI water for my own tanks for very different reasoning, but am finding that the continual barrage of chemicals being added to the city water system is getting very difficult to cope with during these seasonal changes.

[sniggir]

just a question why are you agianst RO/DI water besides the obvious waist that comes while produceing it... I recycle the waste water and use it for watering the garden... i have heard of people using the clean water for thier SW tanks and the waist water for thier FW tanks as it has gon threw the carbon and prefilter and has the chlorine removed... don't know how good it is but.. that is what I have heard at least.

[babblefish1960]

Fair question snigger, it is partially rational, and partially experience, which leaves room for some error of course.

One of the reasons I stopped using RO/DI water was that like using pressurized CO2, I was doing too much to a system that was suddenly a laboratory rather than a fish tank.

In saltwater systems, I am a proponent of RO/DI water, for the simple reason that I am not adding it to the tank without doing something else to it, like adding salt mixtures that contain many minerals that the living system require.

In freshwater, the RO/DI water is devoid of anything useful to me, and along with the CO2, required a vast battery of additives to meet the needs of the fish and the plants.

A good analogy here would be the progression of automobiles in the last 50 years. You lift the hood, and you will notice there is nothing to do, the engine either works, or it doesn't. When I started out, the carburetter always needed adjusting, the needles cleaning, and the tappets setting, along with the points in the distributor. This is all gone now, it is merely a matter of modules that need replacing rather than tweaking.

With RO/DI water in a planted tank, you must figure out what the plants require, and add it to the tank, micronutrients and macronutrients along with simple things like mulm. We are so obsessed with pristine tanks, we remove every particle from the water whether it should be there or not, simply because we believe pretty is best and particles are bad. We vacuum out all the mulm, which feeds the plants, and compensate by adding yet more of what we removed but in a different form that is invisible.

There is definitely a lot of things in our city water now that are being treated to protect us, but these things from both sides of the treatment process create problems as much as save us from anything horrible.

My point in saying I am against RO/DI water, is simply one of barren water, cost and waste. A proper distillation process would produce the purity of water we would want without the water waste, however, trying to prove to the powers that be that the still is for the fish room may be difficult at best.

So, though I am against using RO/DI water for freshwater planted tanks, I have not found a happy solution currently given the problems we are experiencing with what once was good drinking water.

[kennyman]

yea I have always looked at the RO systems as over kill as they deconstruct the water, then we have to reconstruct it to our own specifications. It is a bit much for me.

I have a well and the water comes out quite potable. I suppose I am very lucky, although when you factor in the cost of running pumps and being responsible for managing you own water quality its not like its free water 

I don't like municipal water and I cant drink the stuff unless it has gone through a Brita. Although all your fish must all have good teeth with the added fluorine 

[sniggir]

yea I agree that with FW it realy has no point... but for SW it does remove most of the nasty things that you do not want in your reef systems... I just hate the waist that it produces... so I try and find good ways to use it luckily in this heat I can always use it to water the grass lol

[babblefish1960]

Nowadays, for larger tanks at least, RO/DI makes sense when you consider the thousands of dollars invested in marine livestock and the fact that you are replacing the minerals and elements you require with most salt mixes currently available. The waste water will always be there though, at least some people use it rather than throw it away.

[dan2x38]

Nowadays, for larger tanks at least, RO/DI makes sense when you consider the thousands of dollars invested in marine livestock and the fact that you are replacing the minerals and elements you require with most salt mixes currently available. The waste water will always be there though, at least some people use it rather than throw it away.

With the RO/DI water chemistry changed so much is it really all that potable? With so many of the properties removed/altered during the processing is the water still beneficial to us? Is DI water not good to drink?

I was thinking of an RO system for my kitchen with the pressurized storage tank under the counter. Then I was going to bleed off the waste into a plastic garbage can to be treated for my FW tanks instead of going down the drain.

So is it that a feasible a system to set-up? Or is it just a waste of time, energy, and money?

[Alchemist]

No you can drink it, it's perfectly OK to drink but it just tastes "wet" and a bit lifeless.  Next time you have a glug of mineral water look at what is in it and you'll see tons of magnesium salts and maybe a bit of salt along with a few other things.  That's what gives water a little bit of taste along with oxygenation which you get from the aerator on the faucet.  RO/DI tastes "flat" because it is so pure and the reverse osmosis degasses the water too.  It will rehydrate you just fine but not as well as isotonic solutions (like Gatorade) which have a concentration of salts similar to what you will find in the human body.

[dan2x38]

Would a system work with RO being stored for drinking and the waste diverted then treated for FW tanks?

[fender316]

i still havnt heard any feedback on using well water.....the chances of me relocating in the near future, with a well as my water source are looking high.  im gonna have the water inspected for contaminants, then i can only hope for the best with my salt tanks (after i pass it through the RO).  the waste will be stored in a container for garden and plant use, maybe it will find itself back into the well!  before i test with my ocean creatures im gonna get a betta, see how he likes the water...lol

i also noticed some sort of filter canister on the incoming well water before it goes to the pressurizer, im not sure if it holds carbon or what but im sure i will replace it.  so not to threadcap but i see no issue with using RO, if the waste can be recycled.  Not sure what everyone's water bill is though.

[babblefish1960]

For saltwater no problem, the saltmix is adding the required minerals, but for freshwater, it creates a different problem, there is nothing in it, so you are spending energy, money and waste water to create a water that now needs to have everything that was stripped out of it put back in. An oversimplification of course, but essentially the crux of the matter, especially if you grow plants.

As for well water, that is possibly the largest variable of all, the conditions of the water depend on so many things, such as what the state of the soil is, is the water being retrieved from underneath hardpan. Are there fissures in the drilled well, is there surface leaking in a dug well, does the area have slate, granite or clay overburden.

The best thing is to have your well water tested by a competent laboratory at least once in each season to get an idea what you are up against, it is expensive, but well worth it to know what you have underground.

[kennyman]

If buying a home with a well make sure the water passing inspection is a condition of purchase. The testing done at the local health unit is sufficient combined with the typical tests that we do for ourselves. My water comes out of a 75' shaft bored into limestone. It is far Superior to any municipal system.

If you were to run a ro system on a well you will be running your pump allot more than you need to. That = stress on the pump and you will have to replace it sooner. Your well is sealed so you can not run anything back into it, besides, you would be concentrating all the stuff your filtered out and thats not good. If you put waste water on the ground it gets purified by the plants and soil microorganisms and returns to the water profile that your well draws from.

As for drinking RO water, sure so long as you take multivitamins and eat better to try and get all the important things that have been removed from the water back into your diet. There is many things in water that we need to live. Just like plants we need micros and trace minerals or our bodies do not function properly. Go read a chapter on nutrients in a decent aquarium book or other textbook and you will be surprised on how much micros and trace minerals are available in water before it hits an ro/di unit.

The municipalities have to treat water extensively because the source water they tend to use is contaminated with pathogenic bacteria and industrial chemical waste.

[Shrimpy]

If buying a home with a well make sure the water passing inspection is a condition of purchase. The testing done at the local health unit is sufficient combined with the typical tests that we do for ourselves. My water comes out of a 75' shaft bored into limestone. It is far Superior to any municipal system.

Please be aware that the water test at time of purchase of a new home is for bacteria only. It does not check for VOC's or other chemicals. It you want your well water tested for chemicals you will have to go to a licensed lab and pay for the test yourself. Depending on what you are testing for it will be several hundred dollars.

[dan2x38]

Wow so glad babblefish started this thread... learned so much... mostly though is I do not need an RO/DI unit for either purpose fish or human... TANKs guys... 

Is there a small on tap or other that would be good for drinking water or FW tanks... I guess just a CB will not break down chlormine?

[fender316]

thanks for the well tips,  but we should start a new thread for the well water@!!!1  there is a lab on 2380 st laurent, public health laboratory.  free well water testing provided by city ontario ministry of health.  and thanks for pointing that out kennyman, definetely a condition of purchase, same with the septic, last thing i need is a septic contamination of the well.  if everything checks out i see no problem.  too many variables everywhere to isolate one  (city water vs well would be an endless debate)....if the well water fails the test then i might not be getting the house

http://www.ottawa.ca/city_services/water/wells/1_6_en.shtml

i wouldnt be usuing the RO on planted freshwater but im terrible when i comes to keeping those plants anyway, salt tanks are much easier for me to maintain personally, especially since i got the RO/DI.  I turn on the faucet and my tank gets topped off, its great dont even half to lift a bucket.   im not gonna be throwing the waste water away down the drain though at my own place.  gonna have a huge rasberry garden, it'll come in handy

[ryancarman.com]

forget i said anything

wow !

[BigDaddy]

RO/DI units are not distillers, they are de-ionizers

[artw]

I realized that a few posts ago, "DI" means de-ionized not "Distilled"
Depending on the results of my poll that will answer my question I asked myself if I should keep using Loblaws Distilled water or find some source of RO water

[Shrimpy]

thanks for the well tips,  but we should start a new thread for the well water@!!!1  there is a lab on 2380 st laurent, public health laboratory.  free well water testing provided by city ontario ministry of health. 

Free for bacteria testing only. If you want to check for VOC's or chemical pollutants you will have to pay and it will be expensive there. There is a water testing lab on Colonnade Road. It is called Accutest. They will test your water for everything cheaper than the Gov't lab. http://www.accutestlabs.com/

[Glouglou]

My well water are high in gh an kh, almost no iron, phosphate and nitrate with naturally a higher ph. I simply mix what I call natural water with RO until I get a water with the parameter I want.

And alway replace evaporation water with distill water. It will be impossible to have a low GH, KH, low ph using only my well water.

Maybe I go sometime for an African lake setup but I will probably have to play chemistry to obtain adequate water...