Help! Something is wrong with my platys

[OrchidNow]

I'm so very discouraged/devastated. The other platy died too. The water was around 83 when I got home so ....

And I just changed 5% water about 2 days ago (before all this happens) and another 10% last night. And I went to BIg Al after work....they told me to stop changing water. But how am I supposed to clean the gravel if I don't put back water? How can I clean all the gravel? I got about 1.5 inched of it. But since the danios was my "cycling" water fish, I guess it doesn't matter much. I feel like the cloud of death.

And thanks for the offer. But I don't even want to give ME fish. 

[KLKelly]

OVAS really is an amazing community!

I would be really discouraged also.  My first experience was beyond frustrating but a month in I found great help when I went looking for it online.

Big al's knows you had ich and told you not to change any of the water? 
I think you did the right thing vacuuming the gravel.
Also since you are cycling - depending on the ammonia level you may still have to do water changes.

That being said, I wonder if daily gravel cleaning would still be advised???

Did you get your water tested while you are at big al's - how are your numbers looking?  And how are the danio's looking - any signs of ich at all?

[dan2x38]

How can I clean all the gravel? I got about 1.5 inched of it.

Where do you live? I have a battery operated gravel vacuum. It does not remove water. I will loan it to you if you want. Like everyone said it will work out. I dealt with Ich just like so many here it is do-able...

You will be pleased and have a happy healthy tank soon just like you want...

[OrchidNow]

Thanks Dan. I live in Orleans.

And the danios were fine yesterday but they are not looking good today. Hardly swimming around at all. I can't see ich on them though.

I did put in new water to top it up from all the gravel cleaning. And I changed over to Prime yesterday. The only thing Big Al said "new" is the location of my tank. Sunlight (not today) when we get them hits the tank sometimes. So I have to look for another spot for it.

BTW, I have not clean the filter since the tank started. Should I? I really would like to know what I'm doing wrong.

I think the reason the guy told me NOT to change water is because he thinks it's when I'm changing water, somthing is happening. (Me too) 'Cos every time I change water even only 10% fish die a few days later. When I do about 5%, they were ok. At least from what I can tell. 

Except for a few weeks ago, when others have similar problems, do people have this much problem setting up a tank?

[dan2x38]

Ich is not always our fault. It can be introduced from new fish infested but it is always in your tank. On start-up fish get stressed. Stress lowers the immune system then any diseases, parasites, or fungus can attach the weakened fish. That is maybe why your danios show no signs but the platies passed.

You may have just put your finger on a key issue. Without using Prime which is superior at breaking down chloramine in our water your fish may have been exposed to high levels of this chemical. Chloramine is used to treat our water from contaminates. This summer there have been a lot of reports of sudden fish die-offs on OVAS. A common theory is that there has been a high level of contaminates in our water so the City has added higher levels of chloramine. We can handle it but the fish can't.

Many water conditioners do break down chloramine but unlike Prime do not detoxify ammonia. Chloramine is composed of Chlorine & Ammonia. Now the theory that there are higher levels of chloramine leads to the rest of the dangerous theory. When other water conditioners break down the chloramine they are likely leaving high levels of ammonia non-detoxified in our tanks hence killing the fish quickly after water changes.

If you can sit your water in a bin then treat it. Then let it sit for 24 hrs. Aerate it while it sits there. Use Prime at least at doses times 2 up to times 5. This process has helped many aquarists.

Good Luck and don't loss hope... you will soon be enjoying a beautiful tank with healthy little fishies... 

[MikeM]

Except for a few weeks ago, when others have similar problems, do people have this much problem setting up a tank?

I think everyone has their share of troubles, especially with their first tank.  I dealt with ich and columnaris back-to-back, and lost several fish.  This lead me to set up a quarantine tank, and of course, none of my new fish have had issues since, but better safe than sorry.  Around the same time as time columnaris started, after I had the ich problems resolved, I bought some cardinal tetras.  I didn't know cardinal tetras were wild caught and rather sensitive, and had 9/10 of them die off over the course of a week after adding them to my tank.  By this point, I was very frustrated, mostly because I thought I had done my research.  I fishless cycled, and I chose my fish pretty carefully.  They're an eclectic mix, I suppose, but I researched each species carefully, and tried not to impulse buy.  It took some time, but I've come to accept that to an extent, there will always be things happening in our tanks that are beyond our control.  On the advice of everyone here, I kept my patience, and didn't over-react to any one thing that happened in my tank.

I'm still dealing with my green algae bloom, and was on the edge of frustration with that too, but have been steadily adding plants, adjusting the lights, adding more filtration, moving things around, generally making small changes, and its coming around.  I bought my tank in late June, and at this point, I'm imagining that I'll have a nice, clean, relatively "mature" tank that I won't be embarrassed to show company by Christmas.  I think what all my rambling is trying to say is that, it will probably take longer than you thought it would to get your tank where you want it to be, and that you'll make mistakes and have unexpected bumps along the way, but you can't dwell on that.  There will be accidents and surprises, and some fish might die, and that never feels good, but you have to take it as a learning experience.

You lost some fish to ich, but now you know about it, and have a better idea how to spot it, both in your own tanks, and the tanks at the fish store.  If it happens again, you will be better equipped to deal with it, and maybe you won't lose any fish.  So from one newb to another: persevere and keep your patience.  The first time your tank full of happy fish dances at the glass for you and nips your fingers as you feed them, it will all be worthwhile.

[Fishnut]

How much research did you do before you set up the aquarium?  It sounds like there is a lot you need to learn about setting up and keeping aquariums.  I'm glad you're asking for advice here.  This is what we're here for.

I find the best way to deal with ay aquarium issues is to get as much information on the illness as possible and research how to treat it.  There are often more than one way to treat a disease.  Second you should know that water requirements of the fish you select.  For example, 83 degrees is a heck of a lot for a danio that really prefers to be in water around 75 degrees. 

As MikeM said, the more calmly and methodically a person approaches an aquarium issue, the easier it is to fix.  If a person, however takes drastic action in the heat of the moment, without thinking it through and researching the outcomes, they have a lot of trouble correcting mistakes or problems.

Lets see if we can't ride this crisis out and, as a group, get your tank stable.

[OrchidNow]

I wasn't keeping the temp that hot before the ich. I was told to turn it up (by people here) to deal with that. I'm happy to say the danios look better today. Not as lively as before but not at the bottom of the tank neither.

I thought I did a lot of research. I'm not sure if all my information was correct or not. Just that it seems that it took a long time before I even added fish (at least from my view).

Prior to the ich issue, my fish just lay down and die within a day (of been at the bottom of he tank). They did not have any other sick symptom. So I got a lot of "change" the water advise. And more fish died. But I did read here later, that a lot of people seem to be having the same issues that I did every time they have water changes. So I was down to 2 danios and 2 platys for the last 4 weeks and they look good. So, I decided to do a 10% water change (have been only doing a 5% change only...was too worried to do more than that). Next thing I know, 2 days later the platys have ich.

So I'm going to be "good" and NOT get any more fish till everyone agrees the tank is stable. (Although I had that before too...  ) That will be the hard part. Every time I thought the tank is stable, something happens.

[babblefish1960]

I am glad to see you are still trying, this is the important part.  I can suggest that the raising of the temperature is good, the ich life cycle cannot survive if you keep the heat on for the right number of days.

It is a good thing you are using prime by seachem, you will find that in the long run, it will help.  I would recommend that you use a larger dosage for prime these days, I have been finding a rather large increase in the amounts of chlorine and chloramine the city is using, and it won't hurt the fish at all to increase the dosage of prime.

The curious thing of course, is that the fish sound like they are struggling with nitrite, which they rarely survive, have you any way to test for this?

The only real way to deal with this if it is the case, is to change water, but then the water you are changing with is suspect also, it is a bit of a frustrating situation at times.

Smaller water changes such as you are doing, more often with increased dosage of prime is a good bet.

Now to clarify, if you are adding water straight from the tap into the tank and adding prime to the tank, you need to dose for the entire volume of the tank, not just the water you added.

Above all, patience, you will get through this, and all will work out, sorry about the fish losses, but it is sometimes hard to avoid when trying to troubleshoot the conditions within the tank.  Take heart and know that this too will pass.  Good luck.

[OrchidNow]

No...no... I put water into a bucket, put Prime in it and leave the water bucket for a day (or as long as I can keep my cat out of it).

And yes nitrate, nitrite etc were tested and it was fine every time.

I have not move the tank (it was too heavy now that it is full of water,etc). But I've taped paper on the sides where potential sunlight can get to. So here's hoping that will help.

At this point in time, I can't tell if the danios are ok or not. One of it, is kinda swimming and going nowhere. Isn't that a bad sign? But at least he's no longer sitting at the bottom of the tank.