Starting my first nano! - HELP!

[warr0088]

Well i've decided to finally bite the bullet after admiring saltwater set-ups for a while now, and I want to set-up a nano tank for my first saltwater journey!

I have a few questions regarding the matter:

After all of my reading I have decided to put together an aquarium myself, as opposed to a pre-fab cube ... I am wondering which size of aquarium I should be looking for, with a max size of let's say 20 gallons.  (Space is somewhat limited).  The bigger the better is what I have read thus far, so I'm thinking 20gal is a good size.  Can anyone critique that decision? 

-Should I go with something smaller like a 15gal? 

-Should I look for a regular 20gal or a 20gal long? (More light penetration on a 20gal long, just not sure if you can easily find lighting for them)

-I will be purchasing aftermarket lighting, probably powercompact ... which size tank is easiest to find lights for?  Are powercompact the way to go, or should I go with T5?  (looking to set-up a reef type tank)

-What do people use for substrate: sand, or aragonite?  How much depth do I want?

-Do I really need a refiguim and a protein skimmer?  (I've seen you can easily make a refigium out of an AC filter).

I think I'll leave it at that for now!


Any advice would be GREAT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Faerin]

Hey there, you're off to a good start by asking all the questions before you start piecing things together.

In regards to the size of the tank, get the largest tank you can afford/have room for. More water = more stable parameters which is very important in a reef tank, not to mention you'll have more room for fish and coral!

Lighting, you certainly can (and many do) maintain beautiful reef tanks with CF lighting ... that said, I always suggest going with T5s (or MH on larger tanks). With CF lighting, you'll often find yourself asking if you can keep X coral under your lights ... if you go with a decent T5 setup, you should be able to keep anything you want. If you do go with T5s, you'll have a much easier time if you go with at least a 2' tank.

Substrate, a calcium based (non-silica based) sand or aragonite are your best choices. Don't bother with the packaged "live" sand, it's overpriced and no more beneficial than dry substrate (which will become live in short order in your tank). How deep you want it is really personal preference until you start getting into a deep sand bed of 6" or more. Reef Central has a sand bed calculator at http://reefcentral.com/calc/SandBed.php to help you out with how much sand to buy for your tank.

As far as refugiums and skimmers go, you don't *need* either of these but they are definitely beneficial to have, especially on such a small tank where water quality fluctuations are more apparent. That said, these are both things that can be added to your system as you progress, and don't need to be up and running on day 1. The one question you will need to answer before you start out is whether or not you will be using a sump, and if you do, whether or not to drill your tank. I strongly suggest doing both of these (as will most on the forums); but as with the lighting, many can and do run tanks without if it's just not in the budget.

[Zoe]

With regards to size, I would suggest that you go with as big as you can accommodate and afford.  My favourite size is a 20 gallon tank - this tank is small enough that you won't spend a fortune on live rock etc, but is wide enough for you to do some nice aquascaping and get a lot of corals. If you prefer a tall tank, a 20g tall or 28g bowfrotn is nice, too.
All in all, the tank size is up to you... but as it seems that everyone upgrades eventually, you should just go as big as you can for now.

Powercompacts are sufficient for a reef tank with soft corals, mushrooms, zoas, etc - but T5s are better.  24" is a common size, but you can get or make a 30" fixture - the bulbs are same size, you just stagger them to light the whole tank.

Aragonite is common enough, but some people use sands like tahitian moon sand. Depth is up to - you can go without a sand bed, you can do a shallow sand bed (0-1"), or a deep sand bed (4")... just remember that the deeper the sand bed, the more sand sifters you will need to keep the sand clean.

You do not need a refugium, a sump, or a protein skimmer.  All these things are very helpful, of course, but unnecessary as long as you do weekly water changes, don't overfeed or overstock.

[warr0088]

Great advice thus far ...

As far as tank size goes, I'll stick with a 20gal ... but will light penetration be sufficient if I don't get a "long" 20?  Assuming I go with aftermarket lighting?  (I'm willing to spend the money for good lighting).

There is a 20gallon I can buy for $50, is that a good price?

-I like the idea of sand I have seen in some nanos, I think I will go that way, I really like the small cube set-up at BA Kanata, I'm looking for something of that nature ... perhaps a 2" sand bed!

-One of the other members is selling an AC200 here on ovas ... should I buy this and use it as a refugium?


Thanks!

[Vallely4]

Not sure where your getting the tank, but you maybe able to find a new 20g for $50, no?
They tend to go for much cheaper, somebody else might chime in with prices here, but I'd hope atleast it's in great shape.
Im using a used 20g and stand set-up which only run me $35, waiting for good prices

Also the AC200 should be alright, I have one on my tank. Holds your macroalgae, and live sand if you want. Not much room though for alot of liverock.

With light penetration your talking about, a 20g long(12" tall) will have much greater light penetration than a 20g standard(16") -its 4inches shorter. But neither tank are too tall to be worried about light IMO. Depends do you like a wider, or taller tank?

Great job planning ahead!

[warr0088]

Thanks again for more input, if the height of the 20 gal's really won't affect what I can keep than I will go with a regular one, as I feel deeper tanks allow for more aquascaping .....

The tank I'm looking at is used, I'll continue to shop around for better pricing!

Also, the AC200, I saw an AC70 modded on another nano forum, seemed to hold macro algae and rubble just fine, would the 200AC not be bigger and therefore hold even more liverock rubble / algae?

[Zoe]

Yes, you will get fine light penetration. You only need to start concerning yourself with that over 20" or so, and even then, you can just grow lower-light corals on the sand bed if you need to.  And no problems at all if you go with T5s.

50$ for just the tank, used, is not a good price.

If you're making a fuge out of an AC, get a larger size... like the 70 or the 110.  The AC200 is now known as the AC50, and is the third largest - I believe.

[warr0088]

So as an alternative to the PC lights, how do these T5's stack up to 2x 65 watt PC's? .... wattage is much lower, but could I buy two of these powercompacts to get good lighting over the 20gal?

http://www.petsandponds.com/securestore/c293075p16946252.2.html
or
http://www.petsandponds.com/securestore/c293075p16872949.2.html


-I will look for a larger AC, thanks Zoe!

[Zoe]

They're probably do OK, but you should go with a better quality individual reflector.  My recommendation:
2 x Actinic Plus Geisemann bulbs
2 x AquaBlue Geisemann bulbs (1 x aquablue and 1 x midday)
Workhorse 5 Ballast
4 icecap reflectors

Build that into a canopy with a couple fans, some waterproof endcaps, and you're done.

[xiaan]

For a nice 24" lighting fixture I would go with:

http://www.jlaquatics.com/phpstore/store_pages/product-info.php?product_ID=sl-t5tl2404
or
http://oceanaquatics.com/store/product/3012/Sundial-T5HO-24%22/

They both have individual reflectors which is key for T5.

Or you can go with what Zoe said and DIY your own fixture.

[warr0088]

wow why such a big price diff. between similar set-ups???  and even though going with a set-up like this is less wattage than 2x 65 watt PC's it's better lighting for a tank? 

If I go with the fixture for $219 will I be able to grow just about anything in a 20gal?  (I'd rather not go DIY) ...



THANKS !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[warr0088]

Anyone ever had experience using the 24" Sundial T5 fixture   (The price seems right!)  Thanks for the info Xiaan!

[Sharbuckle]

i would love to know as well about the sundial, i am starting a nano as well and need 24" lighting

[buzzard]

Big diff in price because one is 14w each normal output 1 switch, 1 reflector...
http://www.petsandponds.com/securestore/c293075p16946252.2.html
And the other is High output 24w each with individual reflectors, moonlights timers... top of line.
http://oceanaquatics.com/store/product/3012/Sundial-T5HO-24%22/
IMO I would shop around for parts and make your own.
I just made a 4 foot 2X250w Metal Halide and 2X110w VHO actinic fixture for my 75 gal reef tank with PFO reflectors and cooling fans... for $465.00 (INCLUDING THE BULBS)
If you can give up some time to Do some shopping, on line, hydroponic stores, swap shops...and are a LITTLE bit handy, you can have some AWESOME lights over your tank.
I aquired a 400w metal halide ballist off of a farmer for a pack of smokes (while I was deer hunting) and traded it to a friend for 2 x 250w ballists.
That dosn't happen often BUT, if you can stand to wait for a GOOD deal, do it.
OH by the way, I would personaly go with what the other guys and gals are suggesting, 4xT5s or if you are doing it yourself, I would go with 6xT5, Tight fit but it will work awesome.
I have 2x65w PCs on a 15gal nano 24x12x12 and (imo) they are not worth the $$$$ check the price of bulbs.LOL

[warr0088]

Well that makes two of us ... I also came across this on Ebay and it peaked my interest

http://cgi.ebay.ca/24-Metal-Halide-T5-HO-Aquarium-Light-Brand-New_W0QQitemZ330211811377QQihZ014QQcategoryZ46314QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem


Any comments on which light fixture to go with?

[warr0088]

Sorry for the confusion buzzard, I was looking to compare the two T5 fixtures that were reccommended .... the sundial vs. sunlight .... one is $219, the other is $299, and doesn't come with bulbs .... just seemed like similar systems with a drastic price differences that I cannot figure out.

[Vallely4]

I was almost tearing my hair out trying to decide for about 4 weeks between them for lighting over my own 20gal. lol, before I finally settled and said screw it, metal hailde!    ...wound up cheaper, too!

Here's just my own personal opinion... how I tried to decide anyway.
I think one reason the Sundial is much cheaper aswell is its a large company with many many products, and as they say -you get what you pay for. One reason for not any reviews on the Sundial yet is because its a relative new fixture aswell, I think in the last 6-9 months.

The Sundial  -Moonlights
                 -Comes with mounting legs  (-not hanging like Tek)
                 -Bulbs included  4x24w t5
                 -Individual-bent reflectors (not as good as real 'individual' ones that Tek has, I believe
                 -Built-in timer  (though i've heard one story about someone having to send there fixture to get the timer fixed 3 times, and im not sure they were 100% satisfied)

The Tek fixture  -Great individual reflectors (Keep any kind of livestock, definately)
                      -Great reputation...  every other reef hobbyist has one over their tank
                      -Hangs rather than mounts (Sometimes better, just raise the cord higher to get your hands in the tank -rather than removing the entire Sundial fixture to get inside your tank)
                      -Bulbs sold separately
                      -No moonlights (bummer)