DIY stand for my new 225 gal tank

[Nerine]

It looks AMAZING!! can't wait to see the tank set up next!

[alexv]

I think this thread is slowly drifting from just the stand DIY to the progress of the whole setup, but who cares?

I thought I'd show the inside of the stand. I added 4 dual electrical outlets for the equipment. It is protected by a GFCI. The outlet box is mounted one the left side of the stand and powered by a modified heavy duty appliance extension cord (I just cut off the socket end, removed wire insulation and hardwired it to the electrical box on the stand. The other end still has the power plug which will go in the wall outlet):



I opened up the wall on the right side and drilled two 2" holes in the floor for the drain/return pipes. I decided to use 2" ABS pipes between the tank on the first floor and the sump in the basement (to reduce water resistance and make the pump's life easier). I also added a separate 20A circuit just for the tank equipment with a separate breaker on the panel:



You can see the pipes sticking from the wall, but they are not connected to anything yet and just are hanging "by their necks". When the plumbing in the basement is complete, the actual outlets will sit a bit higher in the wall.



Making the sump, connecting my ReeFlo Dart, setting up the constant water change system and hooking up the tank itself is where the fun begins. Don't even know how to approach this at this point

The pump is stitting in the box:


And the water filter for the waterchange system just arrived too:


So, I'm getting closer to the end of it... I hope soon I'll be able to just sit back and enjoy the view... But till then, a lot of things have to happen. And I'd appreciate any advice knowledgeable people can give me regarding the plumbing/sump set up...

[dan2x38]

The GFCI is in the breaker box? A dedicated breaker for the set-up? Very nice project...

[alexv]

The GFCI is in the breaker box? A dedicated breaker for the set-up? Very nice project...

No, I put just GFCI outlets. The right one of two in the wall and the rightmost one in the 4-gang box on the stand. The rest of the outlets are connected to the 'load' of GFCIs so they are all protected. But the whole thing is on its own circuit/breaker (after thinking how much power I need to for heater/lights/pump/etc I decided to have a separate 20A circuit for it). Given that my tank is rather deep (30") and I'm into heavily planted tanks, I got myself a 72" fixture with T5 bulbs (8 x 80W), so the light alone will be 640W (I guess more when counting ballasts, etc).

[dan2x38]

Nice wish I could add a breaker I rent and no easy access to the box. I have a 75g with a cable heater (under gravel) have you consider that? It helps with filtering and actually reduces heating costs and load on heaters. Heater will be in the sump I guess? My plants love the gravel heater... happy warm feet...

What is the thrashold GFCI outlets in your cabinet?

[alexv]

Nice wish I could add a breaker I rent and no easy access to the box. I have a 75g with a cable heater (under gravel) have you consider that? It helps with filtering and actually reduces heating costs and load on heaters. Heater will be in the sump I guess? My plants love the gravel heater... happy warm feet...

What is the thrashold GFCI outlets in your cabinet?

The wall outlet is 20A (with 20A load). The outlets in the cabinet are 15A. I actually have the heating cable in my current 55 gal... I tried to find a suitable one for 225g and didn't find anything ready-made. I guess I could put two or three of Red Sea Root Therm 160 cables. And I probably would if I could by them from Big Al's USA site (where they are available at US$26.49 each), but on Canadian site the same thing costs CAD$99.99. So $300 in heating cable is a bit overkill (and a rip-off in my mind). I could use Tunze Substrate Heating Cable but I think they are European spec'd and hence I would need a transformer for our 110V.

Anyway, I'm still thinking whether I'm going to add the heater to the substrate.

[dan2x38]

As long as you have a place ship the RedSea ones USPS ground there is no brokrage fees so still cheaper than here. usually get some folks in on a group order. The cables makes a huge difference. It works great to maintain a constant temp. Also the convection it creates in the water creates better filtering and less dead spots. Like I said my plants love it. I have 2 200w heaters they hardly on and not for long.

Would the GFCI outlets ever trip? The filters, heater etc. are never on at the same time. Each one seperate would never come close to 15 amp. I guess lights are going to be the big draw but would only be a spike at start up.

Either way sweet set-up? Be great to see the project develop. How about inline heaters? Doing pressurized C02?

[Hookup]

I'm not an expert, but I have just finished a similar project at my house.  I also live in bbqhaven so if you wanted to come over and check it out for ideas let me know.  Alternately, i'd be happy to swing by your place and we could brain-storm some ideas on the sump and plumbing.

I've spilled enuf tanks over the years that I've got a fairly good grip on setting up a sump so that you do not flood the basement... thats not a warranty btw... hahaha.

Shoot me a PM.   

[alexv]

As long as you have a place ship the RedSea ones USPS ground there is no brokrage fees so still cheaper than here. usually get some folks in on a group order. The cables makes a huge difference. It works great to maintain a constant temp. Also the convection it creates in the water creates better filtering and less dead spots. Like I said my plants love it. I have 2 200w heaters they hardly on and not for long.

Would the GFCI outlets ever trip? The filters, heater etc. are never on at the same time. Each one seperate would never come close to 15 amp. I guess lights are going to be the big draw but would only be a spike at start up.

Either way sweet set-up? Be great to see the project develop. How about inline heaters? Doing pressurized C02?

I called BigAl's US some time ago and asked about that but they said that they will not ship to Canada and I should go to the Canadian store...

As far as GFCI is concerned, it's not really to protect the line from overloading (the breakers do that), but rather to protect me from electrical shock.

Yes, I'm planning to have a pressurized CO2 system (see my diagram in the other thread - the link is in my first post in this thread).

[Hookup]

GFI's are the exact same thing as your breaker in the basement or wherever your panel is.  The difference is the GFI has a MUCH FASTER response time than the basement breaker, which makes it "safer" around water.  But that's all a GFI is, same as a basement breaker, just more sensitive.

I would use them (I think you said you are going to anyhow) as they are a good idea as if you get them wet and do get a shock, a GFI will pop very quickly which can avoid personal dmg and property dmg... while a basement breaker might not be fast enuf or sensitive enuf to save you from a nasty shock or worse.

I've now exceeded my 2cents of value for the day.. that is all.

[alexv]

GFI's are the exact same thing as your breaker in the basement or wherever your panel is.  The difference is the GFI has a MUCH FASTER response time than the basement breaker, which makes it "safer" around water.  But that's all a GFI is, same as a basement breaker, just more sensitive.

It's interesting how GFCIs are misunderstood

GFCI = Ground Fault Circuit Interruper. The way it works is quite different from breaker. Breaker monitors the total current in the hot wire and trips when the current exceeds certain limit (e.g. 15A).

GFCI on the other hand monitors the difference of currents in the hot wire (black) and neutral (white). If there is any disparity (even a few milliampers), it disconnects the circuit. The reasoning behind this is the following. Normally all the current that is sent to a device through the hot wire returns through the neutral wire. If, for example, the hot wire is in contact with water and you stick your hand in the tank, some current will go through your body. This means that the current going through the hot wire will be larger than that in the neutral. And that's what will trip GFCI. If you rely only on breaker, you need to get 15A of current through your body before it trips (you will be a nice brown toast by then). With GFCI, a few milliampers will be enough (you would hardly feel that).

See here for more: http://home.howstuffworks.com/question117.htm or here: http://ecmweb.com/mag/electric_gfcis_work/

[dan2x38]

Could check this out for the Red Sea 400: http://www.dtpetsupplies.com/catalog/Heaters/Cable-Heaters/Low-Voltage-Cable-Heaters/Red-Sea-Root-Therm-400-Root-Heating-Cable/

Thanks I'll check out the link.

[Hookup]

It's interesting how GFCIs are misunderstood

GFCI = Ground Fault Circuit Interruper. The way it works is quite different from breaker. Breaker monitors the total current in the hot wire and trips when the current exceeds certain limit (e.g. 15A).

GFCI on the other hand monitors the difference of currents in the hot wire (black) and neutral (white). If there is any disparity (even a few milliampers), it disconnects the circuit. The reasoning behind this is the following. Normally all the current that is sent to a device through the hot wire returns through the neutral wire. If, for example, the hot wire is in contact with water and you stick your hand in the tank, some current will go through your body. This means that the current going through the hot wire will be larger than that in the neutral. And that's what will trip GFCI. If you rely only on breaker, you need to get 15A of current through your body before it trips (you will be a nice brown toast by then). With GFCI, a few milliampers will be enough (you would hardly feel that).

See here for more: http://home.howstuffworks.com/question117.htm or here: http://ecmweb.com/mag/electric_gfcis_work/

Ok, but other than that they are the same... LOL... geesh, now I've gone and learned something, and I personally blame you...   Thanks for the details.. I was really just quoting what I heard on Homes on Homes...

[alexv]

Ok, but other than that they are the same... LOL... geesh, now I've gone and learned something, and I personally blame you...   Thanks for the details.. I was really just quoting what I heard on Homes on Homes...

I'm glad I've been accused of actually 'teaching' someone Usually it's the other way around.

[alexv]

Could check this out for the Red Sea 400: http://www.dtpetsupplies.com/catalog/Heaters/Cable-Heaters/Low-Voltage-Cable-Heaters/Red-Sea-Root-Therm-400-Root-Heating-Cable/

I didn't know they were making 40W version too. But you gave me a good idea. I started searching more and here is what I dug up - a Hydor Hydrokable 100 watt Heating System  (http://www.petsandponds.com/securestore/c231238p16842148.2.html). At least at 100W and 10m in length, that's so far the best thing I've seen so far. And a price of $50 canadian isn't too bad... Definitely beats 20W Red Sea's at BigAls at 100W

[dan2x38]

I didn't know they were making 40W version too. But you gave me a good idea. I started searching more and here is what I dug up - a Hydor Hydrokable 100 watt Heating System  (http://www.petsandponds.com/securestore/c231238p16842148.2.html). At least at 100W and 10m in length, that's so far the best thing I've seen so far. And a price of $50 canadian isn't too bad... Definitely beats 20W Red Sea's at BigAls at 100W

2 of those would rock. I have the Red Sea 400. I bought it Boxing Day at BA $80 with tax I think.

[alexv]

2 of those would rock. I have the Red Sea 400. I bought it Boxing Day at BA $80 with tax I think.

You think one 100W heater wouldn't be enough for my 6'x2' substrate? I currently have the Red Sea 160 (20W) in my 55 gal (4'x1') and when I stick my finger deep in the sand I can feel it's noticeably warmer in there...

[dan2x38]

God I am not sure. At that price it might be just worth it have the 2. At the cost your looking at an extra $50 is not much... If you had just one it might be a strain on the tranformer. Also the cable would have to be spread futher apart than recommended.

[alexv]

God I am not sure. At that price it might be just worth it have the 2. At the cost your looking at an extra $50 is not much... If you had just one it might be a strain on the tranformer. Also the cable would have to be spread futher apart than recommended.

Hydrokable doesn't actually have any transformers. It's just always on with direct power. It could be connected through a thermostat like this one: Hydor Hydroset (http://www.petsandponds.com/securestore/c231238p16842149.2.html)

[dan2x38]

Only thing if it is not enough you can't add another later.