Buying a house stinks....

[Jeff1192]

We are currently selling our home through ComFree. We are having a new home built and have lots of time so we thought we`d try it. I have some agent friends who helped out with figuring out an appropriate price. An inspection was done and everything is good. We are currently conditionally sold....and hopefully completely sold by tomorrow! We are in a rural area so we knew that the sale would take a little while. We`ve been watching homes in the area for the last few years.

I have to admit I was surprised by the amount of showings we had. We were getting 2-3 per week and I`m still getting calls for showings. What shocked me was how few agents called in enquire. We were willing to co-operate with agents but at only 1.5% as ComFree takes care of all the paperwork. I felt that 1.5% was more than fair for essentially showing my house to a client. Of all the showings we had (about 15) only 3 were to people with agents.

I got speaking with some real estate agent friends of mine and they told me that a lot of agents will downplay the comfree/grapevine homes to their clients saying they`re over-priced, in bad shape ect. I have to admit that I was thoroughly disgusted by the real estate market. That we had so few agents phone about the house tells me that this is obviously common practice for many agents.

I forsee serious changes in the real estate market. If you go to Quebec there are TONS of people selling with ComFree (Par Proprio in Quebec) and in Prescott Russell (not far from my place) ComFree signs are everywhere. I think people are really fed up with paying a 6% commission (which is $25000 with tax on an almost $400000 home) for an agent to sell their home in a couple of days.  Commissions need to be set at a more reasonable rate or at a sliding scale based on time (longer to sell higher perentage) or I think many real estate agents will find themselves without jobs.

I`m not saying this to paint ALL real estate agents with the same brush, but it`s obvious something with our current system needs to change.

Just my 2 cents.

Jeff

[exv152]

We just sold our home in jan 2011, the minute it went on the internal listings for other agents to see, we got call after call for showings. I think we had six in the first afternoon alone. The third person through the door had just lost out on a deal in our neighbourhood, so I think he didn't want to lose out on this too and made an offer for the full asking price the following day. We took five minutes to think about it and accepted. We had already bought another house that was under construction and we were quite nervous the old one wouldn't sell, or it would take a long time to sell. When all is said and done, we realize we could have waited for a bidding war to ensue, but I think we were just happy to be done with it. 

[Fishnut]

Buying/selling a house is incredibly shady.

No matter what your agent tells you, their interest is you selling/buying as soon as possible. They have bills to pay. The more they "help you" find the right deal, the less money they are making/hour and the less they have available for their bills next month. This is why they will push you towards things that are not in your best interest.

I absolutely hate sales strategies: "tiny" becomes "cozy", dilapitated becomes a "fixer-upper", etc.

The moment an agent uses any of those words - I say goodbye.

I bought my first house 2 years ago, and took my time doing so. I went through lots of agents until I finally signed on with one. I feel as though I got a good deal, but who knows, really?

Also, to whoever posted about being added to an automatic e-mail list - don't kid yourself, they ALL do this, I had 3 separate agents do it for me 2 years ago, having met/spoken to each for a total of about 15 minutes.

They ALL WANT you to think your interests are their #1 priority.

Not all agents do that.  FYI...if I have a client who's signed on, they are my #2 priority, behind my family   Good agents don't do all that.  If you don't want to be contacted, just say so when you give them your info.

We have so many regulatory costs, licensing fees, insurance costs not to mention the gas and everything that we have to spend before we make any money...then add to that the brokerage splits that we have...realistically, we don't get paid as much as most people think.  So, when someone only offers 1.5% compared to other homes which are offering 2 - 2.5%...we might as well work for McDonnalds if we're going to get paid so little.  There are agent who will take that, but you get what you pay for IMO.  Corners are cut somewhere to compensate for the lower commission accepted.  Also, most people who have their own agent have signed a contract.  In that contract is the amount the agent expects to get paid (as a percentage).  If the client chooses a property that is offering less commission than the agent expects, it is clear that the buyer will be responsible for coming up with the rest.  If you were buying and one property was offering 1.5% compared to similar properties which were offering what the contract outlines, then what would you choose to see?

I'm surprised nobody explained that to you Jeff.  Also with most private sellers, we actually do MORE work because the private sellers are not an experienced agent.  From my experience...and I've sold a lot of privately listed houses...no matter how savvy people are, they just don't seem to do things properly!

I agree that there will be changes in the business...but as an agent, our fees certainly have to reflect that.  

I added everything together and to maintain my license, I'm paying close to $1000/m in fees and out of pocket expenses (on average).  Then I pay the buyer's agent half the total commission, then I pay my office a third of my remaining commission...that's how the receptionist gets paid, etc.

[Leucotome]

Not all agents do that.  FYI...if I have a client who's signed on, they are my #2 priority, behind my family   Good agents don't do all that.  If you don't want to be contacted, just say so when you give them your info.

We have so many regulatory costs, licensing fees, insurance costs not to mention the gas and everything that we have to spend before we make any money...then add to that the brokerage splits that we have...realistically, we don't get paid as much as most people think.  So, when someone only offers 1.5% compared to other homes which are offering 2 - 2.5%...we might as well work for McDonnalds if we're going to get paid so little.  There are agent who will take that, but you get what you pay for IMO.  Corners are cut somewhere to compensate for the lower commission accepted.  Also, most people who have their own agent have signed a contract.  In that contract is the amount the agent expects to get paid (as a percentage).  If the client chooses a property that is offering less commission than the agent expects, it is clear that the buyer will be responsible for coming up with the rest.  If you were buying and one property was offering 1.5% compared to similar properties which were offering what the contract outlines, then what would you choose to see?

I'm surprised nobody explained that to you Jeff.  Also with most private sellers, we actually do MORE work because the private sellers are not an experienced agent.  From my experience...and I've sold a lot of privately listed houses...no matter how savvy people are, they just don't seem to do things properly!

I agree that there will be changes in the business...but as an agent, our fees certainly have to reflect that.  

I added everything together and to maintain my license, I'm paying close to $1000/m in fees and out of pocket expenses (on average).  Then I pay the buyer's agent half the total commission, then I pay my office a third of my remaining commission...that's how the receptionist gets paid, etc.

But your whole argument is supporting my argument. You have tons of bills to pay. Your incentive is to make a deal quickly, not linger an extra 2 weeks to get an extra 10 000$.

Did you watch the video??

[Leucotome]

Let me just post a quick synopsis:

Here's the game, and how it's played.
It's all based on incentives...what's in it for you, what's in it for them. And it also plays on your fears. Fears that you don't know how to sell your home, that it will be on the market for years and that, of course, you won't get the best price. So, you call a real estate agent and use their huge knowledge of the market to sell your home quickly, easily and for the very best possible price.

And that's the sticking point.

Due to the way commission is structured, it's not in the real estate agent's best interests to get you the best price for you home. Let me repeat that...it is not their priority to get you the most money for your house. No, they want a good price, but they want a quick sale. It is far more profitable to get you to take the first reasonable offer that comes along, than wait another week or two and get $310,000 instead of $300,000. The incentive problem. Let's looks at that more closely. At first it seems well worth the wait. Two weeks for $10k. For you, it is good. Of that $10k you get around $9400. The other $600, that's the 6% commission fee, gets split 3 ways. Half goes to the buyer's agent. Then the real estate agent gets $150 and her firm gets the other $150. $150? For all that time and extra work? Not so great now, and you know, I'd feel the same way. Just look at the numbers. It's simple math.


Sell the house now for $300k, make $18k commission and get $4500 cold hard cash.
Or, wait for two weeks or more, do a lot more hard work, sell for $310,000, and get $4650 cash.

It's clearly not worth the wait, when you could sell early and start work on another commission. This is the problem. Big incentive for you, tiny incentive for the expert. And the experts have many tricks up their sleeves to ensure a quick sale and easy ride.
The code words used in Real Estate ads.There are good words, and bad words. Most of the time, you can make an educated guess. Consider these terms when selling a home. Five are good, five bad. Could you tell which?

• fantastic
• granite
• spacious
• state-of-the-art
• !
• Corian
• charming
• maple
• great neighborhood
• gourmet

here's the answer. The words in italics are good. Why? Because they say something positive and definite about the house. You may or may not like granite, but there's no denying the implication of rich and aspirational. The same goes for corian, maple, state-of-the-art and gourmet. Whatever you feel, you cannot deny the meaning. Now look at the other words. Spacious? What does that mean? Is it impractical, badly laid out, cold, roomy, who knows? Charming is just as banal and ambiguous. And as a writer, I know that using anything like fantastic or ! means you have nothing of substance to say. When a house is fantastic, you don't have to say so....it sells itself. And great neighborhood basically means it's not the best house on the block. When you know how to read the code, and it's not difficult to figure out, you know what the agent is trying to do. Through the use of this language, they're saying "this house isn't so hot...maybe you should make a lowball bid, it may just get accepted." And when a bid does come in that's lower than you'd like, hey guess what, you should take it. After all, that nicer home across the way hasn't sold yet and it's been on the market for months. What happens when a real estate agent sells her own house? That's when the data get's even more interesting. She'll use descriptive words that mean something. Terms like "move-in-condition" and "granite" will be on there. Ambiguous phrases like "immaculate" and "wonderful!" will not. Studies performed by Levitt and colleague Chad Syverson also proved that real estate agents hold out for more money when they sell their own homes. Of the 100,000 home sales they looked at, real estate agents kept their homes on the market for 10 extra days and made 3.7% more money. So, what next? The Internet is your friend. Information that used to be at the disposal of the experts is now readily available. Do some homework. See what is selling, for how much and where. And don't let the real estate agent pressure you into taking a lower bid because the market is "just in a terrible state right now." As sure as night follows day, the same agent will tell a buyer "pay more, the market is really moving." It's truly a cat and mouse game.

[Greatwhite]

Ok, so here's the reason for my belief that the listing agent is shady - and it could very well be the sellers themselves who did this.. However.....

We learned of the house on Thursday night, got a showing at 10am Friday morning and had an offer in their hand for FULL ASKING PRICE on Friday at 1pm.  The only condition was on the inspection, which is standard, IMO.  We have financing approved, etc etc...  

Well, this was one of those situations where "no presentation of offers until May 28" came into play.  However, if you're offered what  you are asking for after being on the market for 1 day - my advice is TAKE IT... UNLESS you are banking on a bidding war and you only placed the house up for that price to get under the magic $600k barrier that people are so scared of.

When asked about closing dates, she wouldn't really say anything...  Just "oh.. I don't know... I'll get back to you"... We were told later "no sooner than July 16" - which later turned into "august 16 or no deal".

Now, you're attracting the $500k-$599k group, which is very popular in Orleans, to come look at a house with a 211 foot deep lot and an inground pool.  The yard itself is enough to make one become emotional in the deal, especially if  you have young kids... A cute little play house was in the corner with dolls and such in it.  I admit, I saw my girls playing in there and was willing to overlook the window job and horrible kitchen -- and lack of home office on the main level.

We hoped to get in first, and put an end to the "no offers until monday" sham.  Well, they rejected the offer, and invited us to resubmit on Monday.  I almost did resubmit -- a brick through their window...  I was NOT interested in a bidding war, and not going to go crazy.

When asked why they were not accepting offers until monday, she didn't say "I want a bidding war!" she indicated that the homeowners were out of town - yet while we were being shown the house Friday, the homeowner's mom came by with a Tim Horton's ice cap for the lady...  Interesting.

Sunday, I told my agent that I was interested in resubmitting the SAME offer - take it or leave it.  He suggested doing a preliminary home inspection so that we could offer asking price and not have any conditions at all.  That's a good tactic if you're really interested in a house because FIRST, you can spend 4-5hrs in the house to see if it "feels" like home - and you can see if the inspection uncovers anything you didn't see in your walk-through and make the call whether you want to go forward.  Yes, it's a $500 gamble...

I got the call last night as my agent was heading over with the offer, and was told that there was 3 more agents heading there too.  It was "suggested" that if I really want the house, it'd be a good time to up the offer already because they go in with their best offer, present it and it's accepted or declined on the spot.  No back and forth negotiations unless it's real close.

SO.. I bumped my offer up to an even $600k (20k more than asking) with no conditions.  Only an idiot would decline that, and only an idiot would pay more for that particular house!  It is NOT a $700k house, yet with all the fixing required - it was about to be.

2 agents were sent home right away, and we were left with my agent and another.  My wife & I were parked in our car, as was the other couple.  If you're truly interested in buying a house - and it's in a situation like this - go park out front.  If there's something little to change like a closing date, it can be done immediately and the deal can close within an hour!

We were there for an hour.  The listing agent came out 3 times, asking for more more more...  More time on the closing date, more money, etc.  We caved and gave more time on closing, and did NOT give more money.  And well - we lost... The other guys offered $16k more, and waived the inspection condition (horrible idea).  That 16k difference, and our "NO CONDITIONS" were equal, it seems.  Anyone can get an inspection and then say "Ok, now let's talk price reductions.... windows, unsafe gas fire place, bad wiring... I want to lower $20k as a result"....

So the shady parts... Asking less than they "expected to get" to get people to look and get emotional -- and spend more than they can afford.  Whether it was her idea or not, she was not honest about it.  Not disclosing ANYTHING honestly -- like closing dates or why an asking price offer was rejected...  Allowing a "make your best offer, and that's it" deal to turn into an auction...

This is simply not the type of activity that I'll be allowing to take place when my house goes up.  We are priced with the market value of my house, plus a little bit for the upgrades.  The same house down the road with NO significant upgrades is listed at $470k on Comfree because he's delusional and came up with a price on his own, I'm sure.  When we come in at $435k FULLY UPGRADED EVERYWHERE, we are not going to be very popular with him.

[Greatwhite]

Let me just post a quick synopsis:


The code words used in Real Estate ads.There are good words, and bad words. Most of the time, you can make an educated guess. Consider these terms when selling a home. Five are good, five bad. Could you tell which?

• fantastic
• granite
• spacious
• state-of-the-art
• !
• Corian
• charming
• maple
• great neighborhood
• gourmet

here's the answer. The words in italics are good.

I agree 10000% with everything you said.  We see listings CONSTANTLY with wonderful charm... This house we tried for..... was FULL OF IT... or.. **it...   "for the person in the apron, there is a beautiful kitchen with wonderful use of space".. uhh.. ok - nasty "granite" counter tops and dilapidated cabinets.. check.  "for the one wearing a tool belt, there is a giant workshop!"... Ok, so - wasted space in the basement for 90% of us.  I loved the workshop, but 12 feet wide, the whole length of the house WASTED on a room that I would go into once in 6 months to find a screw. 

Here's what my listing will say:
> Brand new bamboo flooring on the main level in 2012
> New travertine floors and tile in the upstairs bathrooms with a glass shower and new jacuzzi tub in 2012
> Thomasville maple cabinets in both bathrooms
> New roof in 2010 with 35 year shingles
> New PVC windows in 2010
> New high efficiency furnace and water heater in 2007
> Landscaped front
> extra large lot with 126 feet deep back yard and mature trees and no rear neighbors

Focus on REAL VALUE of things, and not perceived value.  Yes, my house is the best house ever - maybe I should ask for more?   

These are all things that I wish I could see on a listing of a house that I'd want.  Instead, there's a short paragraph about the house that we will be putting an offer in on tomorrow that basically says "everything is beautifully done, upgraded by the builder for $130k..."  That tells me that it wasn't some weekend warrior (like me) upgrading everything, and that there's too many nice things to list??   Really, we want to see it on a whim - as it was "out of our target range" and it sold itself to us - and every other house was compared to it...

[Hookup]

I think the successful agent will be the one that opts for lower commission and more volume...   yes, ultimately the quality of service will decrease, but this is a typical pattern.... mom and pop stores are replaced by box stores then specialty shops arise to provide the lacking service that mom and pop stores used to provide and big-box stores lost but they drive down cost and end up being specialized big box stores until again you get the mom and pop store model back and the cycle continues...

I'm guessing the world of the real estate agent is going the same way... mom and pop agents are going out the door and big-box is moving in (grapevine, and others... driving down cost with little to no service...)


One question for you, if the agent/commission structure is so bad, what is the alternate?  I don't see one.  If everyone was left to sell their own properties, how would you do it?  without mls.ca and grapevine.ca as references, how would you advertise, or get market information about your house value?    Its far from perfect, but its a good system.

[Jeff1192]

I'm surprised nobody explained that to you Jeff.  Also with most private sellers, we actually do MORE work because the private sellers are not an experienced agent.  From my experience...and I've sold a lot of privately listed houses...no matter how savvy people are, they just don't seem to do things properly!

I agree that there will be changes in the business...but as an agent, our fees certainly have to reflect that.  

I added everything together and to maintain my license, I'm paying close to $1000/m in fees and out of pocket expenses (on average).  Then I pay the buyer's agent half the total commission, then I pay my office a third of my remaining commission...that's how the receptionist gets paid, etc.

I understand it.....I just don't agree with it. For me to pay an agent even 1.5% as the buying agent for my home I'm forking over almost $6000. Seems to me that should be more than enough considering all they're doing in relation to my property is bringing their client. Comfree takes care of all the documentation just like a realtor would. I fail to see how a private sale like this is more work for the buyer realtor. Sure the negotiations might not be as smooth because they're not dealing with an experience home seller...but really $6000 isn't enough? To me that's what's wrong with the real estate business.

I realize that we aren't going to agree on this....but that's ok. It's what open discussion is for!   

[Fishnut]

But your whole argument is supporting my argument. You have tons of bills to pay. Your incentive is to make a deal quickly, not linger an extra 2 weeks to get an extra 10 000$.

Did you watch the video??

At the time, no I had not.  How do you now that's my incentive?  My reputation is important.  If I have a track record of selling homes for 10K less than asking, eventually my business will dry up.  Besides, that video was very black and white.  Either full price or much less.  First, people RARELY get a full price offer unless it's one of those situations where it's a hot area and that full price comes in that first week potentially with other offers.  Second, where the agent in the video says take it, what happened to negotiations?  People start low to have room to go up.  I get the point of the video but it's very bias.

FYI...working an extra week on a listing is also no more expensive in marketing.  When a property gets listed, the marketing is paid for and done.  Everything rolls out on listing day.  It's a fortune!!  after that, it's networking with fellow agents, following up on any and all leads, etc.  It gets rolled out again if something changes...like a price reduction.  Who doesn't love a house to be sold in a week, but that's unrealistic.  According to the board, it's taking an average of 60 days to sell right now.  AVERAGE...meaning if you're in a hot area, it's going to take less time.

I understand it.....I just don't agree with it. For me to pay an agent even 1.5% as the buying agent for my home I'm forking over almost $6000. Seems to me that should be more than enough considering all they're doing in relation to my property is bringing their client. Comfree takes care of all the documentation just like a realtor would. I fail to see how a private sale like this is more work for the buyer realtor. Sure the negotiations might not be as smooth because they're not dealing with an experience home seller...but really $6000 isn't enough? To me that's what's wrong with the real estate business.

I realize that we aren't going to agree on this....but that's ok. It's what open discussion is for!   

Yeah, we're going to have to agree to disagree with that.  I have no idea how comfree makes money...no idea!  What about the work we do in the background?  It all goes un-noticed by a majority of the population and they still have to pay someone to do it.  So....40 hours is spent on average with each buyer client works out to less than $20 per hour.  With all the up front risk, the liability we have and the standards we have to uphold, etc...that's a crappy wage if you ask me.  There are Wal-mart workers that get paid that much!

Greatwhite...hmmm...yeah, there was something off on that.  First, it is the seller's decision to hold off on offers at their agent's advice.  I have only been able to jump the line once on a place that was holding off offers and we went in with an offer with 3K over asking.  It was 100% the seller's decision to entertain it or not and I promised the listing agent that I would not be wasting the seller's time.  The rest of the bidding wars, I have been told to wait.  This is simply a marketing practice that works.  Pricing a little low and holding off offers means lots of offers.  Now, what's shifty is the thing about the closing date...in every single bidding war I've been in, the other agent has given me a date or "the end of a month" or something definitive.  If my clients don't care, then it's stated that if this date doesn't work, the sellers can choose a date.  It's also not common for sellers to send back above asking price offers to ask for more money.  I have a feeling that was the seller's decision.  I had a nut-job of a seller that did that against my advice and it completely backfired.  In your circumstance, I guess the seller found a sucker.  It can be a ruthless business...agents have to grow a spine and some ummm...nads to get the job done in some circumstances.

Hook-up...I think you're right.  I'm having a lot of trouble wrapping my head around that concept of my business turning into the next box store style business.  I'm a mom and pop service type of person.  I feel like I'm doing a crappy job if I don't do everything I can for people.  I think there will always be a place for agents like me, just as there will always be a place in the market for luxury cars and high end everything but it's really changing.  This thread is evidence of that.  Maybe there have been too many agents doing too many things that don't sit well with the people they work with. Maybe the board really needs to tighten the realtor code of cinduct.  Maybe the board needs to start a more realistic realtor training program.  We all graduate from our courses and still have no clue how to do our jobs.  I know I made some mistakes when I started.  I still feel guilty.  It's going to be interesting.

[Greatwhite]

I get emailed every time another house meeting my criteria is listed... and 3 came up tonight "no offers until june 2".... I don't like this trend.

[Greatwhite]

Hmmm... Seems buyers remorse got the best of the people who beat us - and they walked.  We got a call from our agent, saying that it's still available if we are interested and the sellers wanted to know if our offer was still on the table.

Well - no, that offer was only valid until 8pm, and then it expired.  TODAY's offer is their asking price, our closing date.  They can take it or leave it.  I love the yard, but the house needs work. We don't love the house enough to come in with $20k over asking (which was our final offer when there was a competition)...

I love with these "shady" tactics blow up in peoples' faces.  When emotions run a negotiation, no one will win.

[az]

buy it plz or you will remain unsatisfied and start 500 new threads, if you like it absolutely go for it IMO.

[Greatwhite]

buy it plz or you will remain unsatisfied and start 500 new threads, if you like it absolutely go for it IMO.

*GASP*  I'm gonna start 500 new threads in the Aqua Valley section just saying "Hi Az" for that!

The nice thing about "The Lounge" here is there's lots of people with lots of their own experiences and expertise that I like to hear about - and it's non fish related...  Shoot - I even got a realtor's take on the situation here.

[Hookup]

Hmmm... Seems buyers remorse got the best of the people who beat us - and they walked.  We got a call from our agent, saying that it's still available if we are interested and the sellers wanted to know if our offer was still on the table.

Well - no, that offer was only valid until 8pm, and then it expired.  TODAY's offer is their asking price, our closing date.  They can take it or leave it.  I love the yard, but the house needs work. We don't love the house enough to come in with $20k over asking (which was our final offer when there was a competition)...

I love with these "shady" tactics blow up in peoples' faces.  When emotions run a negotiation, no one will win.

Why would you lower your offer?  If it was work x to you before, it's the same place, it should be worth x to you today...    Emotion aside, which i empathize with the bull-stuff that you're dealing with, the goal is to get the house you want for your family at the price you want... the rest is just noise...

2cents

[rgauvin]

Why would you lower your offer?  If it was work x to you before, it's the same place, it should be worth x to you today...    Emotion aside, which i empathize with the bull-stuff that you're dealing with, the goal is to get the house you want for your family at the price you want... the rest is just noise...

2cents

I think he wants to lower his offer more to make a point to the seller. The seller employed a little bit of a shady tactic and offended greatwhite, so he is taking the opportunity to do the same tot he seller. But I'm with you, if you were willing to pay X for that house last week, why wouldn't you just offer them X again, get the house for what you were willing to pay, and move on?

[Greatwhite]

Why would you lower your offer?  If it was work x to you before, it's the same place, it should be worth x to you today...    Emotion aside, which i empathize with the bull-stuff that you're dealing with, the goal is to get the house you want for your family at the price you want... the rest is just noise...

2cents

We put in a fair offer (full asking price) last friday and it was rejected.  We "played along" with their game monday, got dragged through the dirt, and now they are stuck... So we're back to our friday offer - only it's a little better now because we had the inspection already.  No one in their right minds would waive an inspection condition ...  At this point, I'm just stickin' it to the man.

[Hookup]

We put in a fair offer (full asking price) last friday and it was rejected.  We "played along" with their game monday, got dragged through the dirt, and now they are stuck... So we're back to our friday offer - only it's a little better now because we had the inspection already.  No one in their right minds would waive an inspection condition ...  At this point, I'm just stickin' it to the man.

well we all know I do like it when the man get's it stuck to him... (hum... that sound weird to anyone else?)

[Severum]

I'm with Greatwhite, screw the sellers for trying to screw you.

When I bought my place I had no previous experience. I came in as a buyer with no representation. There was another buyer who had an agent. Offered 5K below asking, played the first home owner sucker card and mentioned to the seller's agent that with me they would get to keep all the commission for themselves. Well my offer was accepted with no counter and they didn't even get an offer from the other family...

[Hookup]

I'm with Greatwhite, screw the sellers for trying to screw you.

When I bought my place I had no previous experience. I came in as a buyer with no representation. There was another buyer who had an agent. Offered 5K below asking, played the first home owner sucker card and mentioned to the seller's agent that with me they would get to keep all the commission for themselves. Well my offer was accepted with no counter and they didn't even get an offer from the other family...

sounds like a pro move to me man... well played.


I always wondered (and assumed) that there are even more shady deals between some agents... you take $1000 out of your commission on this one for my buyer and I'll give you $1000 on the next one we do... or things of this nature...