Refresher Course on cichlid startup

[zippity]

ok guys: I have a 29 gal. long. Tell me what it is I need to know again about starting up a nice tank with cichlids. I plan on only having about 4 maximum in there. Maximum sizes would be around 3-4 inch range. Can you answer these questions again, sorry for repeatingbut I need to clear things up since I am getting so much info from here, websites and stores:
1) substrate...which is the best for them? PH?
2) temperature....high range to low range
3) water changes...how much and when?
4) feedings.....what and how much daily? do i pick up what is not eaten after 10 minutes?
5) can yellow labs mix well with cobalt blue zebras?
6) can i put a syno cat in there too?
Anything else that can be told without info confusing me would be great.

Thanks

[Jim]

It all depends on the types of cichlids you want. When you have your mind set on certain fish then you can look them up and see what PH and temperature they like.

1) Any substrate as long as its not sharp. Maby a darker colour like brown.

3)I'd say every 2-3 weeks aslo sepending on your fish and filtration.

4)I feed 2 times daily. A medium pinch.

6)yep (i have one for sale if your intrested)

[blueturq]

ok guys: I have a 29 gal. long. Tell me what it is I need to know again about starting up a nice tank with cichlids. I plan on only having about 4 maximum in there. Maximum sizes would be around 3-4 inch range. Can you answer these questions again, sorry for repeatingbut I need to clear things up since I am getting so much info from here, websites and stores:
1) substrate...which is the best for them? PH?
2) temperature....high range to low range
3) water changes...how much and when?
4) feedings.....what and how much daily? do i pick up what is not eaten after 10 minutes?

5) can yellow labs mix well with cobalt blue zebras?
6) can i put a syno cat in there too?
Anything else that can be told without info confusing me would be great.

Thanks

It all depends on the types of cichlids you want. When you have your mind set on certain fish then you can look them up and see what PH and temperature they like.

1) Any substrate as long as its not sharp. Maby a darker colour like brown.

3)I'd say every 2-3 weeks aslo sepending on your fish and filtration.

4)I feed 2 times daily. A medium pinch.

6)yep (i have one for sale if your intrested)

Good advice Jim!

Zippity - a 29 gallon long eh? cool!, never heard of a long style 29 gallon, what are the dimensions of the aquarium?

One thing though..... Synodontis if they are small would be fine a 29 gallon.  Fully grown I am not so sure as they can get "big fat".  But they are compatable with many different types of cichlids.

You could pick up what isn't eaten after 10 minutes.... but I wouldn't bother.  Two reasons:

- The cichlids will probably be foraging the substrate for food during the day/night anyway.

- With regular water changes it shouldn't be a problem (as long as you don't OVERFEED).

Are you looking for information on yellow labs and cobalt blue zebras (as I see you have mentioned them) or just cichlids in general?

If you mean in general, then it would depend on the species of cichlid/cichlids that you are intending to keep and possibly even breed.

[Jim]

- With regular water changes it shouldn't be a problem (as long as you don't OVERFEED).

And make sure to use a gravle vaccume.

[darkdep]

ok guys: I have a 29 gal. long. Tell me what it is I need to know again about starting up a nice tank with cichlids. I plan on only having about 4 maximum in there. Maximum sizes would be around 3-4 inch range. Can you answer these questions again, sorry for repeatingbut I need to clear things up since I am getting so much info from here, websites and stores:

Glad to hear you got your new tank!  We're all happy to help.

1) substrate...which is the best for them? PH?

"Best" would be all crushed coral, or crushed coral mixed in with another substrate.  This provides some pH buffering to the water, and is desirable.  However, it's not required.  Go for a finer, non-sharp gravel or sand as these guys are diggers and will be constantly picking up the substrate and spitting it out.  Brown, Black, or white would be good.  Avoid crazy neon colours.  I use some black sand, fine black gravel, crushed coral, and crushed coral mixed with green gravel in various tanks.  I wish I could change out the mixed green for black or white...

2) temperature....high range to low range

74-82, ideal would be 78.

3) water changes...how much and when?

EVERYONE will give you a different opinion here; that doesn't mean you should get confused, it means that this isn't super-critical.  Some people do 10% a week; some do 50% a week, some do 25% every 2-3 weeks, etc.  You will soon get a feel for what is needed.  I personally aim for 30-40% every 10 days or so, but life often extends it.  There are so many variables to consider (stocking levels, how much you feed, etc) that it's hard to give a "rule" to water changes.  Start with a goal of 25% per week to start, and adjust accordingly.

4) feedings.....what and how much daily? do i pick up what is not eaten after 10 minutes?

Ok, you've got lots of options here.  You can start with a basic food of floating Spirulina pellets (Nutrafin Max is fine), with some added goodies like the (very) occasional treat of frozen brine shrimp or sinking shrimp pellets.  If you go for a synodontis you should feed them some sinking food such as the shrimp pellets as a base.  I use a long fat straw to feed my syno so the shrimp makes it to the bottom (you don't want mbuna to eat too much protein; their bodies can't handle it).

You can feel free to experiment with different veggie based foods as a staple with the occasional protein treat.  Cobalts are mainly herbivores; labs are omnivores; syno's are carnivores.  Plan accordingly.  

An EXCELLENT food to use is New Life Spectrum Cichlid formula.  It's a bit pricey, but it's the most nutritious food you can buy and you don't need to worry so much about the veggie/protein thing having carnivores and herbivores in the same tank.  It's a well balanced food with lots of colour enhancers and no hormones.  I use it myself on my big tank.

5) can yellow labs mix well with cobalt blue zebras?

Absolutely, without a doubt.

6) can i put a syno cat in there too?

Yep.  See http://ovas.ca/bridge/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=5695  (Third Pic).  No issues.

Anything else that can be told without info confusing me would be great.

Thanks

Rocky decor...you cannot have too many rocky caves.  But be sure they are stable; remember the fish will dig, and will dig under the rocks to make more caves.

[zippity]

ok i hope i have figured it out, i may go with 1 male, 2 females of only one species and that may be the yellow labs or the "dogtooth" aka cynotilapia afra chewere or maybe even to something like the neolamprologus pulcher which aka is the "daffodil". So I will get more rocks, a clay pot, and what shoudl i buy as substrate for any of these fish? Crushed coral or sand? Which is better?

[darkdep]

The substrate is up to you! Pick what looks best.  Just go get a bag of crushed coral and stop worrying about it :lol:

Labs and Cyno's, 1m2f each would be perfect.

[zippity]

as i finished writing my last message i got darkdep message too so thanks alot there. I will look into crushed coral. As i mentioned in my last message i hope i have finalized my 3 choices so if anyone knows where i can pick up one of these fish that would be great. And i made a mistake on the 29 gal. long, i just typed that not knowing what i was typing, leave out the long. Do i do a fishless cycle first or do i go by other means?

[Jim]

I would get sand because it look cooler. And if your looking to buffer your PH then add crushed coral to your filter media.

I'd do a fishless cycle.BUT thats my opinion.

[darkdep]

Again, you have cycling options.  You can do a fishless cycle with ammonia, get some temp fish for cycling purposes, or (IMHO, best) just get some mature media from one of your other tanks and put it in your filter.  I personally hate waiting for tanks to cycle so I always do the latter.

Labs you'll be able to find anywhere; I suggest you look in the classifieds as there are some people selling labs in there all the time.

There's someone selling Cyno's in there right now as well.

Cobalt Blues I haven't seen around much lately...but I have a juvie tank that I'll be putting on the market soon.

[Jim]

zippity if you want my syno i can hold it untill the tank is cycled for you if you want. But i don't want to pressure you or anything.PM me.

[zippity]

ok sounds great, got some good words of advice, am gonna work on things starting tomorrow, so hopefully by end of week i will be coming along alot further. This is a new adventure for me, as i am only a couple of years old in this hobby, although i had 1X5.5 gal for about 4 years, now as you see i have MTS, like most here. Trying to get a co-worker to dish off her tank and i dont even know the size of it yet, lol, but i dont even care, lol.

So are Lava rocks a good choice of rocks for these cichlids, and i hope it doesnt matter after all i have a bunch in tank already.

[maitre007]

i prefer sand over crushed coral because i enjoy seeing the cichlids alter their environment to suit their desire/need.  

rock caves are highly recommended for african cichlids.  i have found the plastic logs that they sell at wal-mart make the best hiding spot for cichlids.  

again this is a question of taste.  i know some individuals the mere mention of placing something fake in their aquarium thightens their underwear in a bunch.

I would not advise you to put blue cobalt zebra in a 29 gallon.  i have found that blue cobalt zebra much like the auratus are fishes that require a lot of space.  i think you plan of keeping african cichlid no longer than 3-4 inches much sounder.  in the alternative, the yellow labs would be better suited as they are more docile than the blue cobalt zebra.

my own personal opinion is that malawi cichlids should not be kept in a tank smaller than 55 gallons.  i know i hold a minority view on this subject.  i would recommend looking into the various tanganikyan cichlids for a 29 gallon aquarium such as julidochromis or the brichardi's.  if you want bright colorful ones there's leleupi's and others.

i think feeding twice a day is a good idea.  african cichlids digestive system is meant to eat a lot and create a lot of waste so a weekly water change is a good idea.  it's also a good habit to start to avoid prolonged absence of water change.

for me it's almost reflexes now to do my water change first thing sunday morning.  but i will be the first one to admit that i probably overfeed my fishes to keep the aggression to a minimum so I have to be more dilligent with my water change to compensate for that.

i do not find that lava rocks are good because your cichlids might "accidently" get bumped into them by other cichlids. what i do for caves, i buy those plastic logs at wal-mart for pillars and then i put a piece of slate on of that.  and depending on the height of your aquarium, i do a second level.

i really can't praise those plastic logs enough.

[kennyman]

waterchanges: when cycling keep low levels of amonia and nitrite otherwise youll break the cycle. Once its cycled use your nitrate test kit periodicly. I find a routine that keeps my nitrates under 20 ppm. My scedual right now is 4buckets every sat morn. So I guess that about 25%/week. As my fish mature I will probly have to change a bit more to keep under 20ppm.

[Julie]

Hi zippity, my 29 is definitely a rectangle - more length than height.

Julie

[darkdep]

Plastic logs?  (underwear bunches up)  :lol: :lol:

Lava rock is, IMHO of course, an excellent rock to use.  It has technical benefits (large surface area creates great places for nitrifying bacteria to grow) plus I just like the look of it.  But this really falls into the decoration category which is 100% personal.

I would suggest that full size, full grown Malawi should not be kept in a tank less than 55gal ideally.  But you can do it when they are not full size.

[zapisto]

i always disapointed when people say cichlid and not precise African.
they are a lot of cichlid who is not african (great lake)
- south and central
- west african
etc....

[mseguin]

Welcome to OVAS zap. Some people (cough...pegasus...cough) think the only cichlids are African. :-)

[Julie]

Certainly not me....I thought they were only south american for quite a while.
By the way Matt, I got a surprise in my planted last night - the african butterflies have fry.

Julie

[darkdep]

zap is right...I keep trying to say "African" instead of "cichlid", especially now that I have some rams